1986 iron head l98 corvette valve spring question

Grumpy said:
yes, its slowly but surely improving and will be a fun car once its completed,
I hope the headers are designed to work and provide adequate clearance for the spark plug angles,
you ordered on the heads you've selected.
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The new heads have the same spark plug angle as factory ones I removed, only difference I can see is they recess further into the head, picture above is only with them started a thread, exhaust has shipped and should have it by mid next week, went with ceramic coating and x mid pipe to my magnaflow mufflers and no converters. Valve covers and breather/pcv came in as well...past couple nights switched everything out to poly so that's done and should have it running again by end of next week hopefully
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great, I was hoping that was the case, and mostly posted that,
to get other people reading the thread too,
think about the potential issue if they change either heads or headers,
before changing components its smart to think through,
the potential areas that might cause problems, as a result of changes made.

related
http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/straight-vs-angle-plug-sbc-heads.2712/

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...nstalling-hard-to-access-plugs.962/#post-3056

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...ng-vortec-heads-and-other-heads.401/#post-699

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...s-getting-the-header-clearance.840/#post-9944

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-corvette-l98-heads-any-good.5521/#post-23459

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...r-piston-dome-or-port-volume.2077/#post-35319
 
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Grumpy said:
great, I was hoping that was the case, and mostly posted that,
to get other people reading the thread too,
think about the potential issue if they change either heads or headers,
before changing components its smart to think through,
the potential areas that might cause problems, as a result of changes made.
Click to expand...

Definitely, 100 percent agree...even tho the previous hooker headers cleared the starter I still removed the factory starter and installed a much smaller starter for even more clearance just to be safe and as it was the factory starter figured its 30+ years couldn't hurt to change it.
 
The Melrose exhaust came in, really nice peices and fitment so far is great, there exhaust is 3 inch off of headers so alittle tight near trans but everything clears...

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Well test drive it today, and I say the fast ez efi is a very nice system. After I entered the info it asked for it fired right up without a delay, and started learning once came up too temp, I did have a problem with the first intake tps bracket was contacting the arm of the tps sensor but just ground down the sensor arm alittle and all is good, right now have it set too 8 degrees timing idle and all in at 3200 at 32 degrees and afr set to 13.6 idle, 14 cruise and 12.7 wot but will trim them once it has a full map made. Still waiting for my spark plug wire holders to come in so pic looks messy but just needed to be able to start it .not sure what the car has for power or what the increase was cause still a 350 with the crane cam 114132 but does feel night and day different and does not feel like a tpi what so ever. eventually probably gonna go 383 with roller setup with my top end.

So ended up with the crane 114132 cam with 1.6 rr, afr 190 vortec heads 64cc, accel 36lb injectors, first intake manifold, fast e6 digital igntion, fast dual sync distributer, fast ez efi 2.0 system the fast ecu is controlling timing as well, aeromotive fpr set at 40 psi, aeromotive 340lph pump, Melrose headers and exhaust with x pipe to magnaflow mufflers, motor mounts and rest of car is poly now,
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So ended up with the crane 114132 cam with 1.6 rr, afr 190 vortec heads 64cc, accel 36lb injectors, first intake manifold, fast e6 digital igntion, fast dual sync distributer, fast ez efi 2.0 system the fast ecu is controlling timing as well, aeromotive fpr set at 40 psi, aeromotive 340lph pump, Melrose headers and exhaust with x pipe to magnaflow mufflers, motor mounts and rest of car is poly now,
Click to expand...

sounds like a very well matched combo for brisk, and trouble free, street performance,
please let us know your driving impressions once you get the tune sorted out.
I frequently see guys with really mis-matched components,
its a real pleasure to see someone go through and think things through,
I think youll be pleased with the results
 
Grumpy said:
sounds like a very well matched combo for brisk, and trouble free, street performance,
please let us know your driving impressions once you get the tune sorted out.
I frequently see guys with really mis-matched components,
its a real pleasure to see someone go through and think things through,
I think youll be pleased with the results
Click to expand...

Drove it alittle last few days and definitely was worth it, power has improved through the entire range and has more acceleration than every before and pulls hard right up until it shifts and keeps going, also from a 40mph roll it will take off which wasn't like that at all before, still haven't played with my timing setting or afr but will once the fast engine management system has some time on it, from a stop before would spin but then hook up no problem and now just spins so have to get it too hook up better. But overall well worth it, and very happy with it. Hope to dyno it and see what the improvements have made, also if you have any recommendations for my timing and afr setting let me know and I'll give them a shot, currently timing is 8° idle, and 32° all in at 3000 and afr idle is 13.8, afr cruise is 14.0 and w.o.t is 12.8. Let me know what you think.
 
both your ignition timing curve and f/a ratio are fairly close to ideal,
yes youll be able to tweak it and gain some power and drive-ability but your close now already.
personally ID try to get about a 14.7:1 f/a ratio below about 2500 rpm and slowly transition to about 12.8:1 over 5000 rpm
 
You want the tires to spin an IRS Rear Corvette so the Rear End does not blow up.
I build C3 And C4 Dana 44s.
No one has ever broke mine I built.

Tires spin get out of it.
Seems counter productive but it was never built stock for Drag racing.
They can be built for Drag.
Takes alot of money....one guy spent $250,000 on his I know.
 
it sure sounds like you've, listened too and followed the suggestions and as a result,
assembled a combo that should bring smiles and few problems for years,
no mater how fast your corvette or muscle car , may be,
if you can,t drive and enjoy it or use it occasionally,
you've lost a good deal of the cars potential and in my opinion value.
thats one reason I've stated several times,
that its generally more fun to run a 11-12 second street car,
you can drive daily, than a 9-10 second car you can,t drive except at the track.
Ive owned two cars that I could rather easily clock low eleven second ,
and for one, high ten second 1/4 mile time slips driving
I miss them a bit more than the low 10 second corvette , I built,
simply because I had far more pleasant memories , WHY, ... simple!
I spent far more time on both the street and track with the more street friendly cars.
both my 1965 tempest and 1969 camaro would run low 11 second times rather easily
my 1968 corvette was extensively modified, full roll cage, modified rear dana 60 differential
injectors sticking through the hood, (and more attention than I wanted)
here,s a picture of me in 1970 (49 years ago) with a 1969 camaro I installed a BBC-496 with a tunnel ram into, then later CROWER FUEL INJECTION
paulscamarobw.jpg

1965gtoside.jpg

I found this picture on line,
its almost a clone too what my GTO/TEMPEST clone, I built with a killer BIG BLOCK CHEVY/MUNCIE 4 speed, dana 60 rear differential, drive train, looked like,
its the one car I REALLY MISS that I wish ID never sold
I had built a 1968 vette, in the mid/late 1970s with a full roll cage, a dana 60 rear and 4.11 rear gears and a m21, and a 13.7:1 cpr 496 bbc engine with crower injectors at the time.
CrowerInjectorsa.jpg

MY 1968 corvette was dark maroon
and a chrome bumper 1968 corvette,
but it looked similar to this corvette with the crower injection sticking through the hood
78CrowerFI1.jpg

I've built SBC,BBC,PONTIAC and DODGE/MOPAR, and even a few FORD engine engines for dozens of cars,
the guys that are happiest are , generally the guys that can jump in the cars they own and drive them on the street without any reliability issues
http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...you-regret-selling-the-most.13116/#post-68384

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-resulting-from-an-engine-swap.898/#post-1450

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...best-musclecar-related-memory.2075/#post-5545
 
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Grumpy said:
it sure sounds like you've, listened too and followed the suggestions and as a result,
assembled a combo that should bring smiles and few problems for years,
no mater how fast your corvette or muscle car , may be,
if you can,t drive and enjoy it or use it occasionally,
you've lost a good deal of the cars potential and in my opinion value.
thats one reason I've stated several times,
that its generally more fun to run a 11-12 second street car,
you can drive daily, than a 9-10 second car you can,t drive except at the track.
Ive owned two cars that I could rather easily clock low eleven second ,
and for one, high ten second 1/4 mile time slips driving
I miss them a bit more than the low 10 second corvette , I built,
simply because I had far more pleasant memories , WHY, ... simple!
I spent far more time on both the street and track with the more street friendly cars.
both my 1965 tempest and 1969 camaro would run low 11 second times rather easily
my 1968 corvette was extensively modified, full roll cage, modified rear dana 60 differential
injectors sticking through the hood, (and more attention than I wanted)
here,s a picture of me in 1970 (49 years ago) with a 1969 camaro I installed a BBC-496 with a tunnel ram into, then later CROWER FUEL INJECTION
paulscamarobw.jpg

1965gtoside.jpg

I found this picture on line,
its almost a clone too what my GTO/TEMPEST clone, I built with a killer BIG BLOCK CHEVY/MUNCIE 4 speed, dana 60 rear differential, drive train, looked like,
its the one car I REALLY MISS that I wish ID never sold
I had built a 1968 vette, in the mid/late 1970s with a full roll cage, a dana 60 rear and 4.11 rear gears and a m21, and a 13.7:1 cpr 496 bbc engine with crower injectors at the time.
CrowerInjectorsa.jpg

MY 1968 corvette was dark maroon
and a chrome bumper 1968 corvette,
but it looked similar to this corvette with the crower injection sticking through the hood
78CrowerFI1.jpg

I've built SBC,BBC,PONTIAC and DODGE/MOPAR, and even a few FORD engine engines for dozens of cars,
the guys that are happiest are , generally the guys that can jump in the cars they own and drive them on the street without any reliability issues
http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...you-regret-selling-the-most.13116/#post-68384

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-resulting-from-an-engine-swap.898/#post-1450

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...best-musclecar-related-memory.2075/#post-5545
Click to expand...
Really it's possible to simplify Grumpy.
Just 2 categories.
Street Car than runs on 87-93 RM/2 gas that just has to burn rubber for most.
It will never see the Track Dragstrip.
What it actually runs or puts out does not matter at all.
They will never street race anyone.
Know better with D cars all over the USA.

Then there is RACECAR.
Runs on 110-120 Motor Octane gasoline.
Methanol Alcohol.
E85 fuel.
Nitromethane 30- 98 % mix.
Ultra High Compression 12.5 - 18.0 : 1 static.
Engine full of Titanium metal.
Rev limiter is Valvesprings.
Power Adder used such as Nitrous Oxide.
Supercharged.
Turbo Boost.
Modern goal is 1000 Hp Baseline.
Happy Memories for me are all RACECAR PUT ON THE STREET DOING BATTLE WINNING.
RUNNING FAST AT DRAGSTRIP TOO.
GET DARED THE RACE IS ON TO WIN.
 
So I got curious that once put my heads and intake on while the cars runs good that if the cam I originally put in it is optimum for my build so I have contacted 7 different cam manufacturers to see what they reccomend for my build and then compare all of them too what in there now (crane 114132) and see the differences, and so far Robert at crane has got back to me, and also asked them to give me recommendation on flat tappet and also there thoughts and recs on a roller retro fit..crane retrofit fit would be same specs other than lift is different to take more advantage of heads... this would be a custom grind but definitely different when I punch the info into my engine building program. Uploaded the crane specs
 

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keep in mind the cam above is a hydraulic roller cam

the cam below your using is a flat tappet hydraulic cam

Brand:Crane Cams

Manufacturer's Part Number:114132

Part Type:Camshaft Kits

Product Line:Crane CompuCam Cam and Lifter Kits

Summit Racing Part Number:CRN-114132

UPC:021174028195

Cam Style:Hydraulic flat tappet

Basic Operating RPM Range:1,600-5,400

Intake Duration at 050 inch Lift:210

Exhaust Duration at 050 inch Lift:216

Duration at 050 inch Lift:210 int./216 exh.

Advertised Intake Duration:270

Advertised Exhaust Duration:276

Advertised Duration:270 int./276 exh.

Intake Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.440 in.

Exhaust Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.454 in.

Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.440 int./0.454 exh.

Lobe Separation (degrees):114

Computer-Controlled Compatible:Yes

Lifters Included:Yes

Lifter Style:Hydraulic flat tappet

Valve Springs Included:No

Retainers Included:No

Locks Included:No

Valve Stem Seals Included:No

Timing Chain and Gears Included:No

Assembly Lubricant Included:Yes

Pushrods Included:No

Rocker Arms Included:No

Gaskets Included:No

Valve Springs Required:Yes

Quantity:Sold as a kit.

CARB EO Number:D-225-25 (pdf)
To see a list of qualifying vehicles, enter CARB EO Number D-225-25

Emissions:California EO Approved

In-Store Pickup:Choose In-store pick-up (OH, NV, GA, TX) on our web site.

Crane CompuCam cam kits feature cams with special profiles designed to improve engine performance. And they do so without sending the computer into fits, or causing the stalling, surging, or drivability problems some "computer-compatible" cams are known for. They're 50-state legal for the applications listed.

Warranty



you might consider an erson hydraulic roller
http://www.pbm-erson.com/Catalog/Erson/Camshafts/Retro_Fit Hydraulic Roller_E/ERSE119845



ZOOM
SHARE
E119845 - Erson Cams - SBC RH-286-365
Part #ERSE119845
$307.98

EACH

Available
Hot street machines with 10.0-1 compression. Aftermarket dual or single plane intake. 650 CFM or better carb. Headers and 2500 rpm converter. Lopey idle

WARNING: May Cause Cancer and Reproductive Harm - www.P65Warnings.ca.gov
Quantity:
ADD TO CART

ADD TO WISHLIST


  • Advance:
    • 0
  • Application:
    • 1955-1995 CHEVROLET SMALL BLOCK 262-400
      ,
    • 1987-1997 CHEVROLET 262-400
  • Brand:
    • Erson Cams
  • Cam Type:
    • RETROFIT HYDRAULIC ROLLER
  • CID:
    • 262
      ,
    • 267
      ,
    • 283
      ,
    • 302
      ,
    • 305
      ,
    • 307
      ,
    • 327
      ,
    • 350
      ,
    • 400
  • Duration @ .050:
    • 226/234
  • Duration Advertised:
    • 286/294
  • Grind Number:
    • RH-286-365-47
  • Gross Lift:
    • .548/.548
  • Lobe Center:
    • 108
  • Make:
    • Chevrolet
  • Part Name:
    • Engine Camshaft
  • RPM Range:
    • 2500-5500
  • Valve Lash:
    • .000/.000
 
 
 
So ended up converting to that roller cam. And also found a nice cover that has a built in cam button and worked out really nice, also noticed that the dampener was starting to separate so put a ati super dampener on. Obviously had to change out springs, retainer, cups, locks and mic the seat height and all that good stuff. Ended up also using lunatic retrofit roller lifters. But all back together now minus the intake (sent it back to first performance to have him check a couple things on it) but once that's gets back will be running once again.

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Went back to the beginning of your thread and read thru it again. Looks like you have done a
thoughtful quality job of building a very fun car to drive.

Congratulations!!!
.
 
Indycars said:
Went back to the beginning of your thread and read thru it again. Looks like you have done a
thoughtful quality job of building a very fun car to drive.

Congratulations!!!
.
Click to expand...
Thanks, and time will tell. Figured just add to my organial thread instead of making a new one
 
Indycars said:
Went back to the beginning of your thread and read thru it again. Looks like you have done a
thoughtful quality job of building a very fun car to drive.

Congratulations!!!
.
Click to expand...
By chance whenever you get some time would u be able to put my setup through an engine program possibly, would love to print it out if possible if you can. Let me know
 
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