COMMENTS WELCOME, HELP ME OUT HERE GENTELMEN

grumpyvette

grumpyvette

Administrator
Staff member
http://www.grizzly.com/products/g6760

http://www.grizzly.com/products/g3617

http://www.grizzly.com/products/g3616

LOOKING AT THESE FOR THE SHOP......COMMENTS , COMPARING THEM OR OPTIONS WELCOME
the problem in my case has always been that I know how to do the work, how to use the tools and get half insane when I see the pathetic quality of work and the absurdly high cost a few machine shops charge you.
yes I could have spent the money I spent on tools and had several nice cars completed and been far ahead cost wise, but ordering parts and bolting them together or paying 5 times what the works worth, to get shoddy work quality back after waiting for far longer that it should take,makes me insane.
I saved for years to get a MILL and got one 5 years ago.
Ive constantly upgraded welders and Ive had several good drill presses for decades, I looked for a used mill for years but never found one at a decent price that looked like it had much life left, most were worn out or seldom used but well rusted, and keep in mind the end mills or bits, chucks, clamps, and drill bits , vises etc. can cost THOUSANDS more than the mill alone costs

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=9191&p=43136#p43136
 
I don't know anything about that brand, but you should make sure whatever you get has at least a 42" table (48" would be better.) That way you can mill your own blocks and heads.

New tooling can cost more than the price of the mill.

Sometimes you can find a good, older model, Bridgeport for $1,200 to $3,500 and they will throw in the tooling.
 
tools are a bit of an addiction for some of us!:laughing:
the problem is that most of us have budgets that fit this

http://grizzly.com/products/7-x-12-Mini-Metal-Lathe/G8688

but we really would rather have this

http://69.43.61.114/FMPro?-db=wi&-forma ... x=10&-Find

http://grizzly.com/products/16-X-40-Electronic-Variable-Speed-Lathe/G0670

http://69.43.61.114/FMPro?-db=wi&-forma ... x=10&-Find

and this

http://grizzly.com/products/Large-Milling-Machine-12-x-54/G0559

purchasing a tool thats got at best a marginal capacity is rarely a good bargin, if theres one thing Ive found out its that youll ALWAYS find a use for tools and YOULL ALWAYS find out that your pushing the limits on any tools capacity if you buy the minimum size or capacity range tools, its almost always better to buy something a bit larger with a few more features than you think youll need but DO THE RESEARCH, DON,T BLINDLY BUY the first tool you find at a decent price.
and yes IM sure theres far better brands and tools available, I just picked these as a fast example not, as the best tools.


HERES THE MILL I PURCHASED
http://machinerydistributors.com/m1004.htm
 
Wow... Where did you find that?
Good luck on the build, and please keep me up to date.
Where there's a will ...there's a way...
Tuck\o/
 
a friend of mine got a CNC mill large enough to cut anyhitng you are referring to, he said it was a 100k+ machine, but the seller had a bad ad on ebay, low bidders. he got it $11,000, had to go to california to pick it up.

he trained to run the thing and produced some one off parts for his custom 427 cobra build, but mostly the machine sits idle.

i have known matt for 20 years and would trust him. i can forward your text (your last post here) to him and follow up with a phone call to see if he has a way to produce what you need.

also, mentioning this to let you know i have heard of good deals on ebay.

i understand your grief about the possibiilty of someone stealing the designs ( which they could do anyway whether you brought them the plans or not, you just made it easier for them) i designed a line of guitar pedals and had them produced locally but as you say, the cost to build from my sub kept goin up and up, and so did the work i was having to do to fix their poor QC. i was 30, 60, 90 days out on my bill with them as intial sales success tapered off quickly. that put my in a poor pposition to call them on their bad work. i eventually raised a cash buyout and completed the runs myself with all the partials/parts in the buyout.

good luck! would love to see you producing this stuff.
 
http://www.grizzly.com/products/Shop-Fox-Vertical-Mill-9-x-49-/T20828

http://cdn0.grizzly.com/manuals/t20828_m.pdf

if you can afford to buy one a MILL is a great shop tool addition
sfmill1.png

sfmill2.png

foxmill.jpg



yeah a mill may be very expensive but its a great asset in this hobby.
I doubt many people are as involved with engine building as a hobby as I have over time become,
but having watched people that work in "MACHINE SHOPS "
that really should not have access to anything more high tech,
than a screw driver It became all too obvious I needed a mill.
http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-larger-machine-tools-like-a-mill-lathe.8340/
http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-are-you-looking-to-acquire.10920/#post-47935
http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/milling-machine-related.4231/#post-39800
http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...and-lathe-info-you-might-need.2198/#post-8396
http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...ome-help-me-out-here-gentelmen.993/#post-3688
http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...luid-chip-filter-for-my-mill.6093/#post-18813


the more I shop around for a used one the more total ,rusted, junk IM finding,
so talk to me about tooling and what to look for here,
IM not exactly unfamiliar with a milling machine as IVE used several in other guys shops.
but IM always open to learn new things or take advice.
I want to mostly modify EFI intakes and make brackets, make a few custom parts, etc. so I don,t need any CNC controls etc
 
Last edited by a moderator:
http://machinerydistributors.com/m1004.htm

I just bought a mill very similar to this one


this, with my mechanical engineering back ground and experience I doubt ILL get too far off course, but any hints or info about milling you guys want to add will be most helpful, your never in a position where you can,t learn more!

PLEASE post all the basic info, tips etc. you can gentlemen because theres a lot more guys reading this than just myself.Ive used several milling machines in the past but its been a couple years since the last time and I might have forgotten something, I never mind looking dumb, but I sure don,t like screwing something up thru lack of a simple bit of info

OH! BTW I bought the keyed drill chuck that holds 5/8" or smaller arbors with the R8 arbor and the splash/drain pans and coolant pump, cutting oil, drain lines 6" vise for the table and a few other necessary basics
t10058.jpg

t20828.jpg

http://www.grizzly.com/outlet/Shop-Fox- ... 49-/T20828

http://cdn0.grizzly.com/manuals/t20828_m.pdf
and every drill press or mill needs an adjustable vise
sb1217.jpg

http://www.grizzly.com/products/8-Preci ... ise/SB1217

well heres what I bought

btw, if your drilling holes over 3/4" diameter ....
http://www.ridgid.com/Tools/3-12-Bi-Met ... /index.htm
use low rotational bit speed, on your mill or drill press,a good clamp vise and lots of constantly flowing ,cutting oil constantly applied, or your ruin those cutters in one cut, they build heat fast if not covered in cooling fluid, theres pumps and driblers designed as accesories that you can buy to provide that constant flow of coolant to the cutters

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=4231&p=11181&hilit=mill#p11181
g9630_det2.jpg

http://www.grizzly.com/products/Precisi ... Vise/G9630
drillpress1.jpg

t20828.jpg


and every drill press need an adjustable vise, but most of these vises are cheap junk
sb1217.jpg

http://www.grizzly.com/products/8-Preci ... ise/SB1217
http://www.ridgid.com/Tools/3-12-Bi-Met ... /index.htm
 
well the milling machine arrived,
I got my sons to unpack and install it, in the shop which was difficult as it weights 2400lbs, then after carefully reading the instructions its obvious we needed , to order a few accessories like bit holders and cutting bits, coolant pumps, coolant, table clamps, vises,etc.
(easily an extra $500, but that was kind of expected)
but my sons should be able to use the machine once all those components arrive!
this should allow them to do a good deal more
http://www.grizzly.com/outlet/Shop-Fox- ... 49-/T20828

http://cdn0.grizzly.com/manuals/t20828_m.pdf

sfmill1.png

sfmill2.png

the guys at the grizzly site (tech guys) were friendly and helpfull, and understanding)

http://www.grizzly.com/
 
well the milling machine arrived,
I got my sons to unpack and install it, in the shop which was difficult as it weights 2400lbs, then after carefully reading the instructions its obvious we needed , to order a few accessories like bit holders and cutting bits, coolant pumps, coolant, table clamps, vises,etc.
(easily an extra $500, but that was kind of expected)
but my sons should be able to use the machine once all those components arrive!
this should allow them to do a good deal more

the guys at the grizzly site (tech guys) were friendly and helpfull, and understanding)
while I totally agree ,that cheap tools are rarely a bargain, in the long term, and think about the true cost of cheap tools the 6" version of that vise is close to $760, I just wish I had a job I could depend on, that made me enough
to make expenses and allowed a bit of cash flow for tools
Wilton-11707-lg.jpg

http://www.tools-plus.com/wilton-11707.html

http://www.grizzly.com/
anyone with a drill press or a mill quickly finds that drilling steel builds heat and your better off with a constant flow of cooling cutting fluid which obviously requires both a pump and method to keep it flowing to the drilled components and a tray and drain pan or some way to collect and recirculate the cutting fluid, and a realization that the fluid will of necessity be both reusable, water soluble oil base cutting fluid that prevents rust, and not cause rust on the tools
http://www.grizzly.com/products/Rustlic ... llon/H9240
rustlick.jpg

looking at coolants for the cutting operation, any info is appreciated from experienced mill operators??
rust prevention? aid to cutting? tool life? any info at all??
I purchased this coolant pump and tank combo for use on my drill press and mill
t20828.jpg


http://www.grizzly.com/products/h9240
h8140.jpg


http://www.grizzly.com/products/7-Gallo ... stem/H8140

or is this better or worse??

http://www.littlemachineshop.com/produc ... 1229644699

well I purchased this along with the mill and it works good so far
but I got to thinking that all the extra fine metallic chips that get carried by the coolant back to the coolant pump might cause damage so I purchased a few simple components and built a cutting oil filter, to prevent crap from entering the coolant reservoir and pump.
I purchased 2 ft of 1.5" pvc two threaded reducer end caps two 90 degree elbows, two threaded hose barbs and a package of brass scrub pads to act as a rough filter medium inside the pvc . the hose barbs screw into the end caps, the end caps glue into the pvc and the brass scrub pads inserted inside the pvc acting as a metallic chip barrier that easily allows liquids but not metallic debris to pass


pvc_pipe.jpg


SIN_Brass-35.jpg


IMG_7555.jpg



gr527-1.jpg


11873a.jpg
 
IM still buying , table vices, cutting bits, bit holders, coolant pumps, coolant oil, drill chucks etc and teaching my sons (verbally as I watch and instruct them)how to set it up and use it, my old leg and back injuries make doing most things required on the machine myself very difficult or totally impossible at this time, so I need to rely on my sons at times to get things done for me.
as Im
sure your aware the milling machine is just the basic tool, and there's a good deal more expense in the accessories necessary to get it to function, and trying to instruct a new guy when you can,t actually demonstrate things at times is frustrating

heres the machine they get to learn on
http://www.grizzly.com/outlet/Shop-Fox-Vertical-Mill-9-x-49-/T20828

its the same as

http://machinerydistributors.com/m1004.htm
yhst-20481506629148_2052_622895



(WITHOUT THE DIGITAL READ OUT) cost about $4k delivered to the local freight dock, I payed a local flat bed tow truck $120 to deliver it to the shop door, then you need several hundred in coolant pumps and tooling, but I spent that much PLUS in one year having minor machine work done on cars, so over time its bound to be a bargain, I had my sons move it into place on the shop floor.

M1004 - SHOP FOX® Vertical Mill 9" X 49" W/DIG
Weighing in at over 2400 lbs of cast iron and hardened precision ground steel, Model M1004 has the size and stability to handle the toughest jobs. With a 2 HP motor driving 8 speeds from 78 to 2400 RPM, 3 speed quill feed with a micrometer depth stop and auto reverse, and a variable speed longitudinal power feed, this machine has the ability to do the most complex and precise jobs. This brute has both power and finesse! For added performance, the M1004 includes a 2 axis digital readout with up to 5µm resolution, machine error compensation, absolute/incremental coordinate display, arc/line of holes/angled cut functions, and 199 user defined datum points.

* One-shot pump lubrication
* Auto down feed
* Quill feeds/spindle rev.: .0019", .0035", .0058"
* Auto stop with micro adjustable stop
* R-8 spindle
* Longitudinal power feed
* Hardened and ground table surface
* Chrome plated, precision ground quill
* Adjustable micrometer quill depth stop
* Motor: 2 HP, 110V/220V, single-phase, TEFC, prewired to 220V
* Spindle travel: 5"
* Table size: 9" x 49"
* Table travel (longitudinal): 27"
* Table travel (cross): 12"
* Max. dist. spindle to table: 18-3/4"
* Max. dist. spindle to column: 18-1/2"
* Knee travel: 16"
* Head tilt: 45° both ways
* Head swivel: 90° both ways
* T-slots: 3 on 2-1/2" centers, 1/2" studs
* Speeds: 8
* Range of speeds: 78, 98, 197, 278, 670, 850, 1700 and 2400 RPM
* Approximate shipping weight: 2405 lbs.


Ive got 4 different types of QUALITY welders,(TIG,MIG,ARC,OXY/ACETYLENE, ) and a 2500 lb mill, (with added accessories)and cheap drill press, and a 12 ton hydraulic press,but its taken 35 plus years to get to that point
but I can,t as YET afford a decent LATHE, but Im always looking for that great deal
 
milling machine basics you'll need to know

info with videos included in the link and more videos below

http://electron.mit.edu/~gsteele/mirror ... intro.html

http://www.eng.mu.edu/~dlc/machineshop/mill/intro.html

http://techtv.mit.edu/genres/24-how-to/ ... ine-shop-4

http://techtv.mit.edu/genres/24-how-to/ ... ine-shop-5

http://techtv.mit.edu/genres/24-how-to/ ... ine-shop-6

http://techtv.mit.edu/genres/24-how-to/ ... ine-shop-7

yes I know this stuff is only of interest if you actually want to know how things get machined or if you own a milling machine, but it never hurts a darn thing to have the basic concepts down when some machine shop starts to B.S. you about the difficulty of doing some things, if you've got a good grasp on what you want done and how its accomplished you'll make smarted decisions.
the milling machine and the LATHE are the two real basic powered machine tools that allow most machine work to get done, add a decent welder and you can do a great deal of the work on your car or fabricate many custom parts

LATHE RELATED

http://techtv.mit.edu/genres/24-how-to/ ... ine-shop-8

http://techtv.mit.edu/genres/24-how-to/ ... ine-shop-9

http://techtv.mit.edu/genres/24-how-to/ ... ne-shop-10
 
I have several GRIZZLY machines for woodworking.My shop centerpiece is the 3hp cabinet saw with 52in fence and an Excalliber sliding table for sheet goods.The only problem that I have ever had with it was the magnetic switch didnt engage,causing the blade to keep spinning after saw was shut off.A call to tech assistance,never a problem to get through to those guys,had a new switch on the way.They have a quality product at a reasonable price.I have never used the metal machines that they sell but if you call them they would be helpful to ansewering any questions.I used to drive to the store in PA.Kind of a kid in a candy shop to see all those machines on display.
 
."Kind of a kid in a candy shop to see all those machines on display."

I know what you mean, TOOLS are addictive!

Id love a radial arm saw designed for metal with a rotating angle head and a 8"x30" lathe
 
cool new tool. wish i could afford something nearly that cool. took me over 30 years just to get a lathe thats older than time itself. lol. i may never get out of it what i paid for it but the satisfaction of making and modifying my own stuff is worth alot to me. especialy the one off stuff that im always needing......why is it that i can hardly ever find what i realy want? i seem to always have to modify things to get what i realy wanted to begin with. lol.
 
now obviously many guys never get to the point in the hobby where they get into fabricating custom parts
many guys get by with hand tools and maybe a drill press, but for those guys that might want to experiment or know they can make a better part, youll require a few tools like a decent TIG WELDER,or MIG WELDER , a MILL,DRILL PRESS,AND A LATHEyour choices are almost endless and the chances of buying really good USED equipment , from a business that's moving or closing or upgrading,if you keep looking around and researching your options are excellent.
theres a tendency to buy the least expensive tools when first starting out, but that's seldom a great idea, you sure don,t want to spend the cash for top of the line tools when your first starting out either because you can very easily spend many multi thousands of dollars on basic tools and required tooling and accessories, that you'll seldom use in many cases,so think thru your needs.
but remember if you have the tools and acquire the skills there a great deal of satisfaction, in building custom parts and theres potential money to be made

heres some basic choices, your needs may be far different but you can do about 99% of auto related work with these tools, and yes I'm fully aware that for many guys this is just a dream list, and for some of the more skilled the list contains less than top of the line imports that are not ideal for more than hobby use.

millermatic252.jpg

http://www.welders-direct.com/merchant2 ... ode=907321
V205-T.jpg

http://www.welders-direct.com/merchant2 ... de=K1855-4
drillpress1.jpg

http://www.grizzly.com/products/12-Spee ... ress/G7947
mill1.jpg

http://www.grizzly.com/products/Milling ... Feed/G6760
millermatic211.jpg

http://www.welders-direct.com/merchant2 ... ode=907422
lathe1.jpg


lathe2.jpg

http://www.grizzly.com/products/10-x-22-Bench-Top-Metal-Lathe/G0602

a basic working lathe , drill press and mill,suitable for a good deal of auto work can be purchased NEW at a reasonable cost,

every shop needs at least a decent drill press, and a decent welder


and every drill press or mill needs a decent adjustable vise
sb1217.jpg

http://www.grizzly.com/products/8-Preci ... ise/SB1217

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=970&p=2373&hilit=+drill+press#p2373

and HAVING a mill and lathe is a HUGE ADVANTAGE

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=2198&p=5909&hilit=+milling+machine#p5909

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=993&p=4129&hilit=+milling+machine#p4129


Ive got 4 different types of QUALITY welders,(TIG,MIG,ARC,OXY/ ACETYLENE, ) and a 2500 lb mill, (with added accessories)and cheap drill press, and a 12 ton hydraulic press, a lift for the cars , compressor, air tools,engine crane and engine stands,and a 2600sq ft shop,but its taken 45 plus years to get to that point
but I can,t as YET afford a decent LATHE, but Im always looking for that great deal
 
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