first handgun choice

grumpyvette

Administrator
Staff member
"grumpy what would you suggest in a handgun , for a gun to be kept in the home for self defense, Im not going to carry it, I just want an effective handgun if we have someone break into the house some night?, theres been several burglary,s and home invasions in my town in the last year."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... 1VD1D1hLsQ
S&W 1006 10mm
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http://www.brassfetcher.com/Handguns.htm
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Id suggest a good S&W like a 686, a good revolver, in caliber 357 mag with about a 6" or 8 3/8" barrel. The longer barrel helps reduce muzzle flash and aids in accuracy, You can shoot 38 special for targets and gaining familiarity with the revolver and load 357 mag ammo for protection. Ive yet to see one that was not dependable and accurate, and for a first hand gun I think its a better choice than any semi automatic, hand gun like a glock or govt 45 which are both good choices but require a good deal more practice to be proficient with, and your less likely with a quality revolver to have issues like wondering if its loaded, ones in the chamber etc.
then go to a good gun range and get a CERTIFIED instructor to show you how to use it and run a few boxes of good quality ammo thru it in practice, 38 special ammo is usually fairly cheap, so you can practice enough to get fairly good without going broke doing it!.
a good commercial 357 mag load with 125-or 158 grain hollow point ammo, in a 357 mag, if applied rapidly and accurately to center mass on a potential home invader, is a know effective load for correcting assailants ill though thru, attempts at doing you grievous harm.
then make it a point to go back at least 3-4 times a year and PRACTICE with it. if you can get a concealed carry license, you may not want to carry the revolver but the training required to get the license will help avoid problems, and youll gain some info on when and when NOT too, and how to use a hand gun
obviously youll want to keep it some place safe, but accessible
LOAD DATA FOR 357 MAG

http://www.handloads.com/articles/default.asp?id=30

http://handloads.com/loaddata/default.a ... er&Source=
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I will point out that a hand gun is not my first choice for a home defense firearm
a good semi auto 12 ga would be the most effective choice

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THESE VIDEOS ARE RATHER INFORMATIVE


H&K AND BENELLI both sell 8 shot riot guns that are top of the line 100% reliable

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I went to a local range to play with my 44 mag revolver and 45 acp CZ pistol and while I was setting up the bench the guy next bench over ask me where I found ammo for my 45 acp pistol, I said they were hand loads.
at that point he acted a bit strange like he might think I was using ammo that might blow up, he obviously had a few rather interesting misconceptions and he ask me if it was safe to use hand loads, and did I know who loaded the ammo.
I assured him ID used the same hand load combo for decades and that it worked better than most factory ammo I,d ever tried.


6.4 grains of unique , or 8.5 grains of blue dot under a 225 cast bullet, and a Winchester, or cci primer has always worked reasonably well for me
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Ive found these pistols, (THE CZ and EAA ) in 45 acp to be a good value

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the EAA WITNESS is an EXCELLENT VALUE in a REASONABLY PRICED DOUBLE ACTION 45 ACP PISTOL
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/631327 ... bevel-base

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/788068 ... in-cavalry

now we got into a discussion and he said he had always heard, cast bullets caused leading, I pulled my barrel from the pistol after shooting 2 50 cartridge boxes of ammo and ask him if he saw any lead in the rifling?, then I brought in the target and while it was hardly match accuracy it was obviously shooting tight groups because most of the holes were in the 3" orange dots.
I occasionally run into guys that think all hand loads are sub standard quality ammo , but if carefully assembled its just as accurate and dependable as factory in my experience.
obviously the lead alloy used to cast the bullets, the care taken during casting and lubing and sizing of those cast bullets and the reloading process, effects the quality of the ammo, but if done correctly its going to be very high quality.
and its a darn bit less expensive!
IF your forced to fight, for your life,if your opponents not down and out, DON,T STOP SHOOTING!
FAILURE to destroy the CNS (BRAIN OR UPPER SPINE) will usually NOT RESULT in instant stops
even several center mass hits with most good effective hand gun calibers that will eventually prove fatal, will not insure the attacker can,t continue to fight for a few seconds or minutes, even non-survivable wounds don,t necessarily, stop an antagonist instantly, and in those few seconds you could be mortally injured, so if your forced to fight it makes a great deal of sense to select the most effective tools available and to have the practice and experience to use the tool effectively
 
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I got asked about the accuracy potential between various auto loaders and revolvers, now I think most auto loaders are designed primarily as defensive weapons , and certainly having a auto loader that can be brought into action quickly and have it consistently place all its shots in a 2' group at 25 yards easily makes it capable of providing that defensive use function.
Ive consistently found that the better quality revolvers tended to shoot tighter groups than most of my auto loaders at longer ranges given the best hand loads.
Ive seen several 6" , 8" and 10" barrel, length, 357 mag, 41 mag and 44 mag S&W, Ruger and DAN WESSON revolvers that could consistently keep 2" FIFTY YARD, or smaller, diam, BENCH REST GROUPS , off a sand bagged rest hold, and with good quality hand loads being used , while very few auto loaders I see will do that consistently, now there are a few exceptions but they ARE IN MY EXPERIENCE EXCEPTIONS
the only exceptionally accurate auto loader hand guns Ive seen lately are a S&W 1006 and a EAA 45 ACP and a GLOCK 17L.. they keep up accuracy wise with my 686 S&W and mod 29 and mod 57 S&W revolvers
now there's never going to be a hand gun that's ideal for every possible application, but a quality name brand 6"-8" barrel 357 mag, or 41 mag revolver, has got to cover a great many applications as long as concealment is not, one of your main objectives, and for home defense and most hunting the revolver will be fully functional in well practiced hands, and once your experienced a similar 44 mag might be an option to look into, if you prefer auto loaders the larger high quality, full size, brand name pistols like a glock 17, CZ 75B or S&W 1006 Witness Steel Full Size IN STAINLESS STEEL in a caliber like 9mm , 45 acp or 40 s&w or something similar certainly make sense
If your looking to hunt deer a 357 mag will work, if your looking at larger game like bear and elk Id certainly step up to a 44 mag,even a fairly small cartridge like a 44 mag in a carbine or revolver can be quite effective in experienced hands inside of reasonable ranges, this federal 44 mag ammo looks like a good selection,if you don,t hand load, but id point out that with cast flat nose bullets performance is dependent on a good knowledge of the games anatomy and very precise ,and correct shot placement.
a shot thru the green dot will be quickly fatal, place the shot a bit higher and forward to destroy the shoulder and spine if your more concerned with anchoring the animal quickly than maximizing the venison,you pack out, like the lower picture

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and Id also point out that PROPER shot placement and knowing the games anatomy is CRITICAL, I had quite a few deer run when I used a 357 mag revolver for deer hunting when I first started hunting with a revolver and at the time I felt I just needed a bigger caliber, I swapped to a 44 mag, and things improved, but after a few years I had this feeling that it was my increased skill placing shots as much as the upgrade in power, so as a test, I went back to using a 8" 357 revolver, the results proved at least to me, that the 44 mag was more effective but the proper shot placement with the 357 mag made that revolver FAR more effective than I remember it being in fact, I quickly realized that if I was a better shot , when I started hunting with a revolver, I most likely would never have swapped

now that being stated I will say that although I have 100% confidence in the 357 mags ability to kill, the 44 mag is by far the most used hand gun caliber in both pistol and carbines I own and it performs noticeably better on both hogs and deer with 260-310 grain hot handloads, with which you can produce significantly higher hitting power, Ive rarely dropped deer on the spot with a single shot from a 357 mag when I first used it,although they generally didn,t run far with good shot placement, but Ive frequently done that with the 44 mag, and yes I still have some run with good hits even with the 44 mag so its NOT a cure, its just a slightly better tool in my opinion, does it really matter if a single hit allows the animal to live 2-3 seconds longer before it drops if either caliber gets the job done?, now if the animals trying to climb into your tent to eat your butt , or get to you once wounded to seek revenge for injuries,I can see a HUGE difference but on hogs or deer, that run once hit, not so much, as the 357 mag properly loaded kills deer and hogs consistently IF you place the shot well.
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http://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/smith-686/
while it might not be "EXOTIC" its darn sure to be dependable and very effective
If your thinking of buying a hunting revolver vs one for self defense and ease of concealment, Id suggest a 44 mag with a 6"-12" barrel, its not ideal for self defense , but great for hunting..
I think too many guys that are fairly new to hunting with a hand gun mistakenly assume they should and will ALWAYS get almost identical results to what they may be used to getting with the common deer rifles like a 308win,270 win or 257 roberts class rifles
watch video (thats a 44 mag revolver)
Ive loaded a hard cast 300-310 grain lyman or LEE gas check bullet over 20-21 grains of H110 powder in my 44 mag for decades , (start with 19 grains and work up a 1/2 grain at a time ) it shoots clear thru most hogs and deer exiting and still going strong so be aware you don,t want to shoot a deer with a second deer directly behind the first. Ive used a longer barrel 44 mag revolver for most hunts and while I've dropped a few deer on bullet impact most run a short distance even when hit correctly

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[color:#CC0000]shot placements critical[/color], and most guys won't admit they are NOT as accurate with a revolver as they are with a rifle,look at the two thin red and green lines pictured below , neither is ideal, both enter about where a typical broad side shot should, the thicker blue and purple lines compensate for the entrance angle so as to clip through the vitals.
most hand guns don,t produce the same SHOCK as a higher velocity rifle YET they are just as lethal in skilled hands, its just a bit more likely game will travel a short distance after bullet impact because the internal damage tends to be longer and deeper but a bit less expansive, and explosive expansion is not as common, this hardly indicates the damage will be less lethal only a bit different
keep in mind a rifle like a 270 hits at 2-3 times the impact velocity
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great recommendation... for the amateur or novice shooter a wheelgun is excellent because the only immediate action required in the event of a misfire is to continue squeezing the trigger, if one round doesnt go BANG just squeeze again to engage the next one. doesnt require alot of practice or training, even in high stress it has an extremely low probability of malfunctioning... however you should always familiarize yourself with any weapon you purchase.
 
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