ghillie suits, and camo info

grumpyvette

Administrator
Staff member
camos not mandatory, yes you will find you can kill game wearing just blue jeans and a red/black plaid shirt,or even blaze orange at times,
check with the local fish and game department regulations concerning the required blaze orange or similar laws, theres not much sense in spending big bucks on really effective camo like a ghillie suit if your required to have 500 sq inches of blaze orange above the waist and on the head like many states require.

camo works,very effectively in some conditions, but game picks up on movement, and odor even if you use camo. obviously it helps immensely if you know what the area you'll hunt looks like during the time frame and temps youll hunt in

but properly used camo is an asset, generally it will provide the user with a distinct advantage in many cases, if properly employed you do tend to have game get closer before your located. the problem is few people use it correctly or realize controlling movement and reducing odor must also be part of good camo.
camo must match the background, And no,theres no one magic camo that allows you to blend in all,
or even most areas, under all conditions but if you take the time and effort to do it correctly youll be amazed at how effective it is..

the fact that some guys kill deer without wearing camo in no way means its not an asset to those who want to get close to game, you might have gotten close to 100 dear wearing blaze orange.... but you have no way to prove you didn,t spook twice that number of deer that you never saw ,who detected you ,that vacated the area,well before you saw them.
wearing good camos not going to hurt, your chances and in my experience its a very noticeable help in getting into an area and remaining UN-detected longer

movement is the fastest way game will detect you in most cases and learning to use shadows, and camo and the natural terrain to disrupt your outline and hide movement has advantages.
your not trying to look "camo" YOUR TRYING TO REMAIN UN DETECTED AS PART OF THE GENERAL VISUAL BACK GROUND CLUTTER
areas, vary and so must the camo used,and you just won,t really believe how effective good camo can be until youve used it awhile.
but limiting movement , to slow and brief movements and staying in the shade and off ridge lines helps, as does the newer 3D camo with textured surfaces
when the technology exists and its affordable its rather foolish to ignore its potential,
if you can use it.....the extent you use it may be limited by personal choice or blaze orange laws but its still a tool to be used.
yes youll without a doubt take some verbal crap from your buddies if you wear extensive ghillie technology, but used correctly , and in combination with basic skills that keep you in the shadows and off ridge lines and down wind of game you'll also have a marked advantage.
spend more time seated or laying comfortably in the shade ,under a low conifer branch, at key topographical terrain location,or choke points and spend time looking, with your binoculars , more time than tramping around aimlessly and you'll be surprised at the results.
more than a few elk have been dropped with a well placed shot from a clump of mixed conifer and aspen in an area where three narrow side canyons provide access too, and from, and empty into a meadow within 200 yards, in the area I hunt most years, the key is both finding that location miles from roads and hunt pressure and remaining un-detected, on a fairly open slope while you wait for the guys miles down the canyon to push ELK past you
naturally it helps get into and are well before the other hunters tend to force game thru those restricted choke points and watching the wind so your odor won,t give your location away helps.
youll constantly have people tell you game are color blind, well, As far as my experience, has shown me they may not see the same color range but I,m convinced camo properly used provides an advantage to a hunter. I,ve just had too many deer and elk walk within yards of me while fully camoed to think is not working as a tool that allows you to remain undetected

http://www.theghilliesuits.com/

http://www.ghilliesuits.com/

http://www.ijreview.com/2014/10/186562- ... d-snipers/

http://www.turkeyhuntingsecrets.com/sto ... d-leaf.htm
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adding two or three packs of these leaves to most camo makes almost any camo noticeably more effective

http://www.ghilliesuitsource.com/

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viewtopic.php?f=92&t=6876&p=22376#p22376
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youll have a hard time beating a real ghillie suit for max camo in most areas

heres some non-ghillie suit camo

http://yawoot.com/post/1326

http://www.uniteddynamics.com/camo/faq/
 
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grumpyvette

Administrator
Staff member
I should point out that its movement , noise and odor,in about that order ,and a failure to camo the face and hands, that gives away many hunters locations to game
but if you carefully select your camo to match your back-ground and if you move slowly and try to keep in the shadows and moving thru the perimeter brush your far less likely to be spotted.

obviously you'll want camo with the color and hopefully texture matching the area you hunt
most commercial camo has far to much dark brown or black and not enough tan,green and gray for most of the areas I hunt.
now you don,t need a ghillie suit like these,
but it won,t hurt, either and may help your chances
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textured camo is great, and quite effective
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one of my favorite patterns (konifer) is discontinued, but almost any decent contrasting pattern with the correct colors will work if you remember, its movement , noise and odor,in about that order ,and a failure to camo the face and hands, that gives away many hunters locations to game and if you move slowly and try to keep in the shadows and moving thru the perimeter brush your far less likely to be spotted.
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grumpyvette

Administrator
Staff member
You can,t shoot game you never even saw, and you'll be astounded at the amount of game in areas you never see because THEY see you first and avoid getting closer or allowing themselves to be seen,Ive tested the results over many years in many locations, and in many different terrains and Ive had the conversation dozens of times about the need to wear ANY camo , or even if its truly helpful, the truth is that game does not see colors exactly the same way we comprehend colors or detect movement and that your movement, scent, and basic shapes also influence your success rate are remaining unseen , and your skill at using cover and terrain will either help or hurt your results even if you use camo.
we have all been successful at times with out wearing any camo,but after running several simple tests, and changing from camo to non-camo clothing, I can assure you that decent textured camo when used correctly makes you far harder to detect when you use even minimal skill at using cover,terrain and shadow, for enhanced concealment.
example,
I had a wide saddle area between two canyons with very little cover available,that looked like an excellent choke point that we hunted almost every year in Colorado,as it was only about a 30 minute walk from a logging road in good elk country, we looked at that spot as almost a 100% sure location to kill deer,(occasionally ELK) we generally positioned ourselves, on the down wind side of the area and we were occasionally successful , but it was not until we tried using a quality ghillie suite that we found out just how often were were being spotted by and avoided by game that would have used the saddle to travel between canyons.
after we started using the ghillie suits , or at least textured camo,when were were hidden and observing, in wait for game we saw far more ELK and deer, while we usually saw 3-4 animals during an evening watch, after we started using the suits that jumped to 8-12 animals an evening, and when we forgot the suits the resulting traffic dropped noticeably.
now don,t get the idea we were sitting up in plain site on some ridge, watching that saddle, we were generally sitting behind a few rocks and sparse brush in an area that was about 180-200 yards from the open well traveled game trails in the saddles central area in either case.
 

grumpyvette

Administrator
Staff member
http://yawoot.com/post/1326#5

http://www.camouflagepatterns.com/

viewtopic.php?f=92&t=5623&p=17163&hilit=camo+stock#p17163

http://www.strictlybowhunting.com/index ... le&sid=271

now Im surely not the best hunter on the planet, but I do really try too get in close at times
I always try to take max advantage of shade and natural cover and shadow play,and theres been several times a deer or ELK got shot at almost effective bayonet ranges
I firmly believe that scent killers, very effective camo, and vitamin supplements, like chlorophyll tablets that significantly reduce body odor helps Ive had other hunters walk by me , passing within 1-2 dozen feet of my location while I sat at the base of trees or in blow-downs numerous times in the past,
now Im fully aware you can be very successful without camo, but I find its a great tool that provides you the extra advantage you can use, to me wearing blaze orange is a P.I.T.A. thats required in most areas but something I detest complying with.
when you have shot game at under 10-20 yards fairly frequently you become a believer in camo and using shadow and natural concealment as a tool.
I have had ELK and deer walk by me on several hunts that I could more than likely killed with a spear, I had one deer actually stop and stamp his hoof and try to get me to flinch as he stared at me , as I sat with my back against a large log , wearing a ghillie suit from less than 5 feet, he knew something was wrong but was not sure WHAT I was, I had a cow elk feed by me at less than 15 feet that only noticed me once she was dead down wind .......so how many of you guys BELIEVE IN EXTENSIVE CAMO?


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grumpyvette

Administrator
Staff member
THERES A DOZEN PLACES TO GET MATERIALS OR KITS TO BUILD A CUSTOM GILLIE SUIT, and DON,T IGNORE YOUR RIFLE.
A properly fabricated ghillie suit will allow you to get much closer to game, in some conditions.
yes your bound to find a dozen guys that swear its a waste of time and money, but where I can use a ghillie suite Ive found I get better results, its hardly mandatory but it helps increase your odds of getting close in my experience.
while some game are thought to be color blind, they all see movement and texture and matching the back ground helps avoid detection

https://camopedia.org/index.php?title=Main_Page





http://www.theghilliesuits.com/Jute.html

http://www.ghilliesuitdepot.com/product ... e-Kit.html

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RESULTS CAN BE GOOD IF ITS DONE CORRECTLY, BUT YOU NEED TO BE CAREFUL AND REMEMBER EVERYTHING'S IMPORTANT, YOU CAN,T LEAVE THE RIFLE, YOUR FEET, YOUR HANDS OR FACE, ETC EXPOSED AND EXPECT TO REMAIN UN DETECTED,
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and you can,t USUALLY use a LEAF PATTERN THEN HIDE IN GRASS, OR THE REVERSE LIKE THESE TWO BELOW

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THESE GUYS PICTURED BELOW, HAVE ALL SCREWED IT UP IN SOME WAY, FAILING TO MATCH, COLOR,MATERIAL,OR CAMO SOME COMPONENT


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THIS GUY ABOVE, DID A GREAT JOB BUT FORGOT HIS HANDS AND RIFLE ARE ALSO IMPORTANT
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some guys fail to camo the rifle, their face or hands, or use camo matching the terrain they hunt, and that is a huge flaw in the concept of remaining un-detected
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THESE GUYS PICTURED BELOW, SCREWED UP GOOD CAMO BY FORGETTING THEIR SHOES AND FEET ALSO SHOW
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RESULTS CAN BE GOOD IF ITS DONE CORRECTLY, BUT YOU NEED TO BE CAREFUL AND REMEMBER EVERYTHING'S IMPORTANT, YOU CAN,T LEAVE THE RIFLE, YOUR FEET, YOUR HANDS OR FACE, ETC EXPOSED AND EXPECT TO REMAIN UN DETECTED,

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grumpyvette

Administrator
Staff member
BTW when you get your ghillie suite kit they will come with basic instructions,
what they don,t STRESS, and most likely should point out is that to make it work correctly you want to work on small areas and use no more than 4-6 strands of color thread per web connection on the netting under lay and use the same color thread over a 3-4 inch square area then shift to a different shade for the adjacent area, use of more than 4-6 strands produces a far heavier , bulky matted look, use of smaller areas results in a rather mono color mat appearance, not true camo that disrupts the person wearing its outline
https://www.theghilliesuits.com/ghillie-suit-kits.html

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a patchy pattern like this tends to blend better in many back grounds
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and remember if your going to use a GHILLIE SUIT to allow you to remain undetected while watching for game, that you need to try to stay in the shadows, locate yourself DOWN WIND of any area your watching, and remember increased distance and natural brush near you help reduce your chances of being detected, reduce movement to nearly ZERO, sit or lay down to reduce your visual exposure area, and hopefully use colors matching the areas back ground and position yourself in brush to get the full effectiveness of a GHILLIE SUIT, get your hands and weapon camo also and with practice youll be amazed at how close you get to most game


not much sense in use of a ghillie suit if your going to ignore the weapon and your hands or matching the local color paterns and back ground texture like these guys below
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sometimes things FIND YOU!
Im sure some guys think wearing a ghillie suits pointless
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well I had a rather memorable hunt one day while seated under low hanging cypress branches, dressed similar to the photo above. I was seated on the side of a large lake, located 5 miles deep in the ever glades,from most access roads.
I was waiting for game at that location as that particular year was a bit drier than usual and along comes a swamp buggy with a gal and a guy on it who proceeded to go skinny dipping and really enjoy themselves, all while I remained motionless, seated on the opposite shore line in some cypress brush,watching totally undetected from about 170 yards away, it may not have helped the hunting but it was unexpected and entertaining.
 
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grumpyvette

Administrator
Staff member
Ive had several Un-injured ELK and easily more than a dozen UN-injured deer walking within 5-10 feet of me on several occasions over the last 55 years , some ran by , some walked by.
I,m convinced that properly used camo helps you get closer to game.
I take a great deal of effort to see how close I can get on most hunts
and yeah! Im a huge believer in camo and GHILLIE suits and DETEST hunter orange
camok6.jpg

so every chance I get I look more like this
than this

Your 100% correct, theres no doubt that movement and scent are the big give away,s game used to locate predators, but youll never have any idea how much game avoided you as a hunter by spotting reflective and light catching gear simply because they vacate the area when they spot you long before you had a chance to spot them.
anything you can do to lower your chance of being recognized as a threat can,t help but increase your potential success rate.
I'm sure anyone could wear head to toes, blaze orange and chrome mylar and occasionally kill game but the odds go up in your favor if your almost impossible to visually locate.

now personally I think even wearing orange hats and vests doesn,t help you avoid being seen by game , but obviously theres laws mandating its use.

now this IS not directed at any particular person,its just common sense,info, but it should be obvious that some clothing is far easier to see in the wooded environment at a distance even if your not moving , and staying in mixed shadow helps break up the human form
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have you ever considered ty-dyeing support socks,
the support hose look similar to this before being stretched over the stock on the rifle,
the object is having a dull, non-reflective and muted outer cover protecting that rifle stock while you hunt
this if done correctly can cover barrel, stock and optics completely eliminating most reflective surfaces
and reducing the potential for scratching the rifle
a couple tye dye socks and rubber bands can do a great deal

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Grumpy

The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer.
Staff member
I found this video , and after watching it for several minutes I had to laugh,
WATCH CLOSELY
at the assumed stupidity level the videos maker must think the viewers, must have.

honestly the premise, of the video is based on the idea that the guys camo pattern was what made him hard to see and locate, distance and use of cover were much more effective, factor's
the fact is in every case he was 90% hidden behind brush before he started to reveal his location,
a good camo pattern like a decent ghillie suite provides would allow him to sit or stand with 50%-70% exposed in the video forground,and still remain difficult to locate
https://www.theghilliesuits.com/ghillie-suit-kits.html
judge for yourself if camo properly employed makes you more difficult to locate
the key is obviously matching the terrain and proper materials, location and no movement, and ideally mixed shade and sunlight and logically locating yourself for both good observation and comfort, you need too remain close too motionless for hours

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/grumpy-does-camo-work.14500/#post-85541

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Grumpy

The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer.
Staff member
how effective are hunting scent elimination products
if you do some research the answers rather obvious..
the truth is you can reduce but never eliminate your human scent or odor,

cover scents can be used to help partially mask your scent, and various products will reduce the amount of scent your leaving around the area/
get up over 20 -25 feet in elevation in a tree stand and on a hotter and dryer day ,
( once the sun comes out, the air currents tend to move and rise and as moisture evaporates it reduces your odor pool.)
thermals tend to rise, and with a bit of a breeze youll drastically reduce your scent pool in the area.
youll never eliminate your scent trail, down wind, yet you can reduce it significantly, with cover scents and odor reducer sprays
but scent absorbing sprays clean clothes and masking odor scents will help, reduce the ease of game detecting your presents
be aware of its MOTION and your human silhouette that will betray you frequently, decent camo and breaking up your human silhouette
goes a long way towards making you far less obvious.
yeah most of us are forced to wear an orange vest and hat, but its lack of movement and reducing your human silhouette
and odor trail that can help improve your odds , I have frequently gotten into 30-40 yards of big game
and used a handgun very effectively, so its certainly not impossible to do



its just common sense,info, but it should be obvious that some clothing is far easier to see in the wooded environment at a distance even if your not moving , and staying in mixed shadow helps break up the human form
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read the linked info it contains a wealth of info

https://www.fieldandstream.com/arti...nt-control-measures-really-make-a-difference/

https://catchthemeasy.com/best-scent-killer-for-hunting-reviews/

https://biggamelogic.com/cover-scent-for-deer-hunting/

https://www.fieldandstream.com/arti...control-products-and-practices-vs-a-drug-dog/

https://forums.bowsite.com/tf/bgforums/thread.cfm?forum=2&threadid=373498

https://www.bowhuntingmag.com/editorial/science-scent-control/310499


https://thegearhunt.com/best-scent-blockers-reviewed/

https://bowtricks.com/best-scent-eliminator-for-hunting/


https://www.amazon.com/Febreze-9759...ywords=febreze+no+scent&qid=1571415110&sr=8-8
 
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T-Test

solid fixture here in the forum
Animals that are use to humans will not be bothered by your scent. Waste of money to try and mask it IMHO. I use to sit on a 5 gallon bucket in a canal ditch on farm land and deer and bear would both jump as close as 5 feet from me to go to the field to feed. I also used fox pee on a drag rag attached to my boots to walk to my tree stands. Once climbed my stand and turned around and 2 deer were staring up at me, confused to see me and not a fox. Small does, so didn't shoot. I miss those days.
 

Grumpy

The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer.
Staff member
never underestimate how effective good camo can be,
while wearing a similar ghillie suit, I built ,to the picture below,
I had a couple does stand about 3-4 feet away and sneeze and stamp hoves trying to get me to move.
I had a raccoon walk up to me while wearing that ghillie suit and circle me several times,
he knew something was not right but could not figure it out.
on a different occasion, while I was sitting against a stump wearing the ghillie suit,
I had a doe bed down about 20 ft away
she stayed there for at least 30 minutes, then got up and wandered away.
making me a firm believer in the use of a ghillie suit where it is allowed
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Grumpy

The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer.
Staff member
most experienced hunters will tell you
its usually movement and scent that gives hunters away to deer,elk.
not the color or pattern of the clothes you wear,

plenty of guys kill deer wearing blue jeans and various patterns on red or orange plaid shirts
THIS IS true BUT THAT DOES NOT MEAN you can't marginally,
or in some cases very effectively increase your odds,
of not being detected with good camouflage USE!
I've worn ghillie suits , sitting against a tree stump and had deer,
elk and hunters on many occasions,

walk by up wind of my location,
at less than 20 feet away many times.

failure to take advantage of natural brush ,

to break your outline, take the time to find and sit against or next to,
or under low
branches,
use brush, conifer, stumps rock outcrops
or terrain to break up your shape,
use texture, or 3d camo, use distance, use shadows ,
position yourself down wind of the deer / elk travel areas,

limit movement ,
or use camo too cover you face, hands, boots and weapons,
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defeats the process and reduces camo effectiveness
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look over the pictures posted above in the thread

. many areas mandate use of blaze orange vests & hats
simply because many "HUNTERS" are careless and don't verify targets well,
so this does marginally increase your odds of not being mistaken for a deer,
by the few idiots who carry firearms







 
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Grumpy

The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer.
Staff member
while not nearly as good as a true ghillie suit ,
textured camo is generally far more effective than simple print patterns
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