Harmonic Balancer Installation

[zman57]

Grumpy,

I found your thread on the tools and I have a good removal tool but I need to purchase a good installer before I install the damper.

Here is my question that I posted on CT:
Just received a new 7" ATI Super Street balancer to install on my small block crank. I was wondering has anyone installed a balancer like this onto a 327 crank. I was expecting to use a harmonic balancer tool to remove and install the new balancer. The new balancer is a two pc. design with a hub and outer ring. The directions recommend to press fit the hub onto the crank
Press as follows
1.0000" - 1.2500 .0009 to .0012
1.2510" - 1.34750 .0008 to .0011
and so on

Could you please explain what the manufacturer is recommending about the press on fit? The press fit, can I achieve this with the installation tool, or are they refering when you are rebuilding a motor and the crank is out to have this done at a machine shop?
use the correct tool to install the balancer
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/OTC-6505/?rtype=10

Step #3 from the directions " OEM cranks are typically to tolerance +/- .0002. If you are using an OEM GM crank you can hone the damper hub to 1.24600" +/- .000
Again I was'nt expecting this when I ordered the balancer, I am not a machinist and I am trying to replace the balancer with the motor in the car. Is all of this really necessary these numbers seem to awfully tight specifications.
I don't want to screw up because if I attempt to put the balancer on and does not go I cannot return the balancer.
There are a couple of machine shops in the area that I could take the hub to and have them hone it. I do not know once I remove the old balancer if I purchased a micrometer whether I could read it accurately?


Thanks for all of your advice.

Zman

 

[zman57]

Well I removed the balancer this afternoon and purchased a digital caliper. The crank snout measures 1.250" O.D
The balancer hub ID measures 1.239"
The difference being 0.011"
The ATI directions tell me to hone the new hub out to 1.2460.

Is 0.007" alot to hone or do you think I can use my damper install tool and put the hub on?

If not looks like I have to wait till Monday and take the hub to a machine shop?

 

[grumpyvette]

READ THIS THREAD CAREFULLY FIRST
http://www.atiracing.com/products/dampe ... ctions.htm

http://www.atiracing.com/products/dampers/

READ
http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/damper-tool.223/#post-260

http://www.tavia.com/cat12.html#1

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000F5LIW4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

https://www.otctools.com/products/harmonic-balancer-pullerinstaller-set
link to order replacement parts you may loose or break on that damper tool
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/otc-4531/replacementparts


https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000F5LIW4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


https://www.otctools.com/products/harmonic-balancer-pullerinstaller-set


damn the gal in that video, makes that process, look a whole lot more difficult in the video that it generally is,
and yes its very easily possible to over tighten the interchangeable central adapter screw,parts
if your not careful, and yes they do sell replacement adapter screws
(never lend tools to your friends, or you'll be buying , and replacing those replacement threaded, adapter components)
use moly grease on tool threads

http://www.jegs.com/p/ATI/ATI-Super-Dam ... 7/10002/-1
MOST NASCAR TEAMS USE ATI DAMPERS AND THEY CERTAINLY HAVE THE TEST DATA TO SUPPORT THE CHOICE

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=223

viewtopic.php?f=53&t=1798&p=4587&hilit=balancer+tool#p4587

since the cost of the tool is so low, and in my case its used at least monthly,(frequently more often)
I can,t see having a tool kit without one, and at between $24-$40 for the tool depending on the brand its hardly a major investment, youll spend that in gas going to borrow it over a year or two

http://www.jegs.com/p/Proform/Profor...53075/10002/-1



in my opinion,that 0.011 undersized is an absurdly undersized hub ,
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/d ... umber=5649

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/d ... umber=5043
.

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/d ... mber=97163

IF your 100% sure you measured correctly you'll need to take the hub to a local machine shop and explain the interference fit and have them correct it to a more reasonable, .0003-.0004 interference fit like the 1.4600-1.4700 bore in the damper hub will provide.
yes you could do it, but that's a GREAT DEAL to hone and your VERY unlikely to have a consistent diam. when your done with a home hone job

remember to grease the inner and outer surfaces with anti-seize (I usually mix roughly anti-seize 75% with 25% moly grease and coat both surfaces lightly with grease on your finger before assembly)
a machine shop should be able to do the hone to size far more precisely as too dimensional consistency along the total internal bore length of the hub than you can at home

read this

http://www.go-fast.org/z28/damper.html

yes IM fully aware of what the instructions from ATI indicate below

http://www.atiracing.com/products/dampe ... ctions.htm

btw for the ls series engine guys
http://www.atiracing.com/products/dampe ... ctions.htm

forged components are generally stronger
(IE will take abuse longer and at greater stress levels) and forged pistons are slightly more heat resistant than hypereutectic or cast
as a general rule if your going to exceed 100hp shot of nitrous or have the rotating assembly spin at near 4000 feet per minute in piston speed forged components tend to be a good investment

viewtopic.php?f=53&t=110&hilit=4032

viewtopic.php?f=53&t=343&p=1170&hilit=redline#p1170

viewtopic.php?f=53&t=204&p=239#p239

 

[Kenny Bee 194]

I have seen Summit and Ford Racing recommend heating a damper in boiling water for 10 minutes prior to installation. I haven’t gone to the length of using boiling water but I have put a damper under the hot water tap for around 5 minutes prior to installation with a damper install tool in the past. What’s our group’s thoughts on this technique?

Also, does anyone use any type of sealant in the damper keyway groove prior to install to ensure it doesn’t leak? I haven’t done that in the past, but again was looking for the advice from our experienced forum members. Thanks.

Kenny Bee

 

[Grumpy]

I've used loc-tite on the crank key just to help insure it stays in the crank slot.
and greased both the damper and crank snout before the install, but heating the damper in boiling water sure might help,
EXPAND IT TO MAKE IT EASIER DURING THE damper install!
never beat a damper on, use the correct tool

don,t beat that damper!

use the correct tool, beating the damper onto the crank, snout frequently damages both the damper and the thrust bearing in the engine, and while the resulting damage is not critical in all cases or instantly obvious it DOES damage and stress the blocks main caps and the crank and the trust...

garage.grumpysperformance.com

thrust bearing wear

heres some basic info in my hard drive records http://www.thirskauto.net/Engine_Thrust_Bearings.html http://www.aera.org/tech/tb1465r.htm viewtopic.php?f=50&t=9409 http://www.stealth316.com/misc/clevite-77-rod-main-bearings.pdf http://www.small-block-chevy.com/assemblyspec.html...

garage.grumpysperformance.com