How close to the “10.1-10.5” ideal trans and rear gears ratio will my 3200 stall bring me ?

9

95Stockercorvete

Member
Hello Guys ,
I’ve read the very educational threads here on grumpy’s trans /rear gear ratio sweat spot . I however do not know what the equation Is when factoring my stall range . When I use the trans x’s Rear ratio I am not optimal at 9.39 . Can some one tell me how closer I am to the sweet spot of 10.1-10.5 including my stall converter ? I did the Dana 44 swap last summer as well as the new stroker . The 3.07’s where the ratio of the 44 I bought . 4l60e 3.06 ratio in first
Thanks ,
GOD bless ,
Robert
 
for max performance swap to a 3.73:1 rear gear ratio, but in my opinion,
a 3.42:1 rear gear ratio, the converter stall speed affects how well the car drives and accelerates,
but has little to do with the ideal gear ratio being used,
swap would be closer to ideal, as it would give you both a very noticeable boost in acceleration, decent cruise, at a reasonable rpm,
and better gas mileage plus a 3.42 rear differential gear ratio, x your first gear 3.06=10.46 (a 4l80e has a 2.48:1 first gear ratio, so a 3.73:1 rear gear with that transmission makes a bit more sense)
JUST BECAUSE YOU CONVERTER STALL IS RATED AT 3200 RPM DOES not MEAN THE CAR IS NOT EASY TO ACCELERATE AT LOWER RPMS
YOU STOMP ON THE GAS AND THE CAR WILL BE ACCELERATING FORWARD WELL BEFORE THE ENGINES REACHED 3200 RPM PROVIDING THE BRAKES ARE NOT LOCKED

calculate gear ratios, and when to shift calcs

you really should read all the links and sub-links below to maximize your understanding of the concepts, in the thread READ THE LINKS AND SUB LINKS http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/matching-the-drive-train-to-the-engine-combo.741/...
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www.silveradosierra.com

All-In-One Final Drive Gear Calculator

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matching the drive train to the engine combo

HEY GRUMPYVETTE? I'm building a mild performance, 9:1 static CR, 350 for my 55 and looking into camshaft choices...I understand the intake closing point (degrees) will affect the dynamic compression ratio (DCR)....My question is what DCR should I be shooting for? and what rear gear and stall...
garage.grumpysperformance.com

 
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Thank you Grumpy ,
Aaaaand great minds think alike . I am absolutely going to change the gear ratio , after pay Chad for the new stroker, Allen for the Permabilt trans , new ignition, track tires and rims blah blah , $$$ I’m going to drive with the 3.07’s this summer . Seattle has a limited window for dry days lol . I am thinking 3.73’s and I did the math on the 3.45’ and 3.54 the 3.45’s are the. it’s. On best match . But , until then I was hoping the Stall being 3200rpms would get me closer to the 10.00 ratio match . I will go through the threads you suggested and see if I can come up with it . If anyone is a quick genus I would love the answer !!!
GOD bless ,
Rober
 
I don't see where your HAVING AN ISSUE THINK IT THROUGH

you have a 3200 rpm stall converter, you want every shift to fall close to or over that 3200 stall rpm
after each shift if your daily driving and want close to max efficiency with the drive train
the stock trans, under low or part throttle demand shifts fairly early or low in the power band


look take this calculator, you want to shift for max efficiency,
under moderate throttle, acceleration at part throttle,
for mileage and power transfer at near your torque peak,
lets say just for giggles shift at 4500 rpm(stock engine)
and use a 3.42:1 rear gear
insert a 3.06:1 first gear
1.63:1 second gear
1.0 third
and .70 od gear for you trans
you want every shift to fall close to or over that 3200 stall rpm,
keep in mind the engine still pulls hard well below the converter stall speed,
your cars moving well before your engine exceeds 3200 rpm, unless you have e brakes locked!


if you have headers, a cam better heads etc,
you'll shift at closer to lets say 5800 rpm with a stock trans controller
use a 3.73:1 rear gear
you want to have shifts to fall closer to the engines torque peak,
lets say at the 4500 torque peak to get max acceleration
shift at 5800 rpm(stock engine)
and use a 3.73:1 rear gear (then do it again with a 3.42 rear gear)
insert a 3.06:1 first gear
1.63:1 second gear
1.0 third
and .70 od gear for you trans
you want every shift to be at close to 5800 rpm, for max performance
you want engine rpms to fall after a shift to or over that 4200 rpm torque peak, rpm
in both cases you see results

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I was hoping that with a stall converter it would close the gap on my less the perfect trans gear x rear gear = 9.39 currently . There must not be any effect on this number if a stall converter is introduced to the equation. I somehow in my mind thought that while reading through the multiplier with the optimal being 10.1-10-5 that in one thread you said I’m not going to include stall converter’s to keep it simpler .
I must of misunderstood . I know I need new rear gears . I do in fact have all my shift points dialed in . As I stated , I mistakenly thought there was an equation that included Trans gear x Rear gear x Stall converter=‘s adjust final drive ratio ! My bad , I’m over it and saving for new gears . Lol . Thank you for the shift points lesson though . Seems I’m on track there !
 
Indycars said:
We have an Excel calculator here on this website you might want to try out.


The spreadsheet is protected, but there is not password. So if you need to edit for your situation, feel free to do so. If you need help, just let me know !
Click to expand...
You are Awesome Sir,
I will absolutely use this tool when I get home this evening . Thank you for your time in finding this calculator and posting it !!!!!
GOD bless you Sir !
 
Well, there is no doubt my next project ( this winter ) will certainly be rear gears . I’ve got the Engine I want Golen 396 stroker making over 500hp and 499 t, it runs well !!!!! I have a new 4L60e from Permabilt with all the good stuff and mods! , I swapped the Dana 36 to the 44 as I mentioned . The 44 I bought had 3.07.1’s in it . I’m certainly leaving some meat on the bone as far as optimal driveline performance with the 3.07’s ,heck I’ve known that since the day I was counting rotation in the old guys garage I bought it from . Lol . The Trans 1st gear x’s the Rear gears =s 9.39.1 leaving me well short of optimal pairing . As I told Grumpy I’m gonna drive the car this season on the 3.07’s ( I literally finished the above project at the end of summer last year . I got about 50 miles on the car from the seat . My first test hit for data for my tuner ( Solomon) resulted in a great rip till the car shifted at 122mph put me in the marbles a bit :) , but it’s a corvette so we drove right threw it ! But the 3/4 clutch pack from my old ( built ) 4l60e went right out the rear exhaust with that shift . Lol , break em , build em back better ! Right .
So this thread was to find out is the 3.07’s with the 3200 stall helps close the performance gap in any way till I change gears in the pumpkin this winter . Does the converter help the underwhelming 3.07’s performance at all ?
 
That 4L60 has a big jump from 1st to 2nd gear, which means you have to over wind it in first so that second doesn't lug too bad. Have you thought about going to it's big brother the 4L80 ?

If you don't want a electronic trans, then you could go with the 200-4R. It has nice set of ratios and cruising on the highway with the 0.67 overdrive sure makes it nice. I'm using the 200-4R and with 31" rear tires and a 3.55 rear gear I'm only turning 1900 rpm at 70 mph. The down side to the 200-4R is that it will need considerable strengthening to hold up to the higher HPs and their getting harder to find parts. I do have a pretty complete inventory of stock parts and 2 complete trans. I bought out a transmission shop of all 200-4R parts that was closing. The HP parts might still be easy to find, just have to check.

Gear Ratios for GM Trans.JPG
 
F9A5ECA4-70B4-422D-9E43-21FB54B52CB6.jpegHahaha , yes sir I’m $3k sure on the Permabilt 700rwhp 4l60e a Just had Allen build for me in California. It’s Guaranteed and Dyno tested . I’m hoping the 3200 stall will put me in the meat of the cam and motor on the second gear shift . The built a custom shift kit for it and it’s all sonnex smart shell and output drive , they upgraded the 3/4 clutch pack to 8 borg Warner clutches and 9 metals . Did some custom notching for better lube to the sun gear and the 6 planetary. It quite a work of art . It’s here at my trans shop the car is going in Monday for the install , they sent a nice trans cooler with it and a bigger B & M pan . The new converter is a 10 inch 3200 rpm . I was hoping to gain some performance on the 3.07.1’s with the converter till I swap to a 3.45 05 3.73 rear gear . What do you think on the converter making up a little gap on the 3.07 off the line ?
 

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Well it definitely sounds like you got a sweet trans! When it shifts to 2nd, will the rpms drop below 3200 rpm? I doubt it will drop below 3200 for more that a split second. Beside 3200 is a stall rating and you are already moving, so no I don't think it's really going to help much. But it would be a great question for Allen at Performabuilt, that's in his wheelhouse.

They do make a different first gear ratio for the 4L60. Expensive at $700-800.

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2.84 Ratio Input Carrier Kit - 77284-K

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Ratio Input Carrier Kit, 4L60 / 4L60E / 4L65E / 4L70E

4L60 / 4L60E / 4L65E / 4L70E 2.84 Ratio Input Carrier Kit, Sonnax 77284-K. Shop On Our Website For More 4L60E / 4L65E products Today! Or Call 318-742-7353!
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Yes sir , they do make a 2.84.1 1st gear ratio. I seen the option , but I like the 3.06.1 ratio coming out for the bite ! But it does drop pretty good . I gotta say Allen and Frank have been super awesome to work with . The Tranny is not in yet , but so far the process is great . Rpm and Monster both wanna core charge and shipping . I frankly believe that 1st off, Permabilt has a better unit . They have a real time bench build video piece buy piece with why and how come narrative. It’s 1.24 hrs ( you tube ) but if your in the market for a close too built proof 4l60e guaranteed and Dynoed for 700 back tire horses . The watch is a must. Allen does not want your tranny and the sale of $2700 includes shipping , a very good cooler and as I said a bigger pan . The other guys want like a $500 core and $300 shipping charge applied at checkout .
Once I have a few miles on it , I plan to do a write up for the Corvette forum as well as my new vacation home forum here at Grumpy’s
 
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Grumpy,
Absolutely!!! I’m already vested in my 4l60e , direct fit, fits the tunnel on the corvette perfect. You know getting anything in that space on our c4’s takes some doing . But it has been done many times . This guy fits my needs perfect for my 95% street car 5% track ( have full 4 corner set of Hoosiers on their own A-molds though ) car !! These guys are a pleasure to work with !
 
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