I want your thoughts on the difference

grumpyvette · May 18, 2014

like most of the stuff you might really want in this hobby the best stuff sure ain,t dirt cheap...but its available and these companys like FAST,KINSLER , edelbrock,HOLLEY MSD, INGLESE and several others have a wide selection, and varied in design features and the ability to make excellent power that will require you do some rather extensive research into what features and restrictions each system potentially provides, or limits you too?
what do you guys like?
even us old geezers have to recognize that modern computers and software, and sensors can at times have advantages over the older mechanical systems and its becoming obvious that the computer and sensor controlled EFI systems have improved a great deal recently over what it was just 15-20 years ago.
theres no question that a well set-up and correctly tuned EFI set up can provide a bit better mileage and lower exhaust emissions and with modern computer and sensor controls ease of starting and other advantages over most carburetors,or mechanical injection, that arguments , long been settled, peak power with carbs vs injection is similar,and carbs generally cost less (the only areas they truly remain competitive)
what do you gentlemen think is a good value or something you "LUST AFTER" in the modern programmable efi systems

notice the two throttle body injectors above have 4 injectors inside the throttle body and no fuel rails or injectors in the intake runners making them easily interchanged on a carburetor 4 barrel intake, this allows far faster installation, use of existing carburetor intakes in many cases, and a longer distance to allow the atomized fuel to mix with the airflow and vaporize which in theory might provide better fuel economy under low load cruise conditions

the up to now more common direct injection with an injector in each individual intake runner connected on two fuel rails like the picture below has the advantage of more precise control over each cylinders fuel/air ratio as the injector delivers fuel spray directly in a fog directed at the back of that cylinders intake valve

BOTH THE SYSTEM ABOVE HAVE THE POTENTIAL TO BE MODIFIED FOR USE ON DUAL THROTTLE BODY SYSTEMS, HOLLEY EVEN OFFERS THEM on the LS series engines , and they are easily adapted to other engine families by skilled tuners

87vette81big · May 18, 2014

I long for None shown above Grumpy.

I would like True Mechanical Injection with a Barrel Valve system, Fuel Shutoff Valve, Custom plumbed built Fuel Resevoir Holding Tank & Main Stainless or Titanium Fuel cell.

Just like what you had on your 1968 496ci BBC 4-Link Dana Vette that would wheelstand & Run 10's on a bad day.

I really hate EFI.
I know all about it but still hate it.
That guy at FIC Left a bad taste in my Mouth since my demise from Corvette Forum.
Be the same till I die.
Just like that Muslum Bama.

87vette81big · May 18, 2014

I would like to Clone the Hillborn Injection system used on Mickey Thompsons Challenger 1.
1 Pontiac V8 engine. There was 4 seperate Hillborns on that Salt Flat Streamliner.
There was a special Cast Aluminum timing cover, Blower drive setup, & The Hilborn itself.
In 1959 it was normally aspirated. Special Hilborn Intake used too then.
1960 Superchargers added to exceed 2000 HP without Nitromethane added.

Bo Laws 1085 cfm 4150 series Pro Flow Race & Belt drive Fuel pump is what I bought. Could afford.
Saved up a few summers ago.
Starved but I wanted.
Can always use on other engines too.

philly · May 19, 2014

if i had to use programmable efi i would wait a couple generations untill MSD's "wired less" atomic efi setup works out all the kinks... right now the holley dominator self tuning plug and play stuff is so advanced in what its capable of and what it does right out of the box that if i had to buy something today i would get the holley... but the wired less efi stuff from msd is a brilliant idea that needs to pick up speed and supporters, once people start frequently saying they have successfully run that stuff with power adders and used the built in nitrous programmers and anti lags and all that crazy suff that usually gives people heheadaches... once they get the same testimonials that the holley stuff has, i would jump on it because its just much better packaging. right now holley is dominating that market because they were the fist ones out the gate.

http://www.atomicefi.com/

bytor · May 19, 2014

I have been looking at these systems for a few years now. The ‘self learing’ of some of these systems is impressive. Bolt it on, plug in a few basic engine parameters and start it up. I liked the ability to tune across the entire driving condition range another benefit of EFI. The tuning knobs and switches most of these systems offer is impressive. My experience with carbs and a wideband O2 meter was it’s a bit of a compromise from a tune perspective. I always ended up with an area somewhere in the RPM curve that was a little bit rich or lean but not really noticeable. I could live with the compromise as well as more $$ in my wallet. But, I'm a bit of a computer nerd when it comes to this stuff.

Look at it slightly differently from a cost comparison. With your carb setup, you may need wideband AFR meter to assist getting the carb dialed in. So, lets say $500 for a 750 Speed Demon carb plus the Innovate LM-2 Wideband OS kit at $350. Now you at $850. Getting close to the cost of one of these EFI systems. Most but not all of these systems also have ignition control as well as cooling fan and fuel pump control. Add those features into the equation and it makes for a nice upgrade.

I’ll admit I’m no expert tuner but learned a lot about carbs with the use of the wideband on my C3 vette. Typical tuning session. Pull the carb bowl, make a jet change, drill some brass restrictions for high speed air bleed, put it all back together and go for a ride. Analyze the LM2 logs and make more carb adjustments. Ooops, messed up my off idle due to the changes I made to the top end. These EFI systems make it easy to dial in every possible operating range of the induction system perfectly. Not having hands on experience with these systems, I suspect you can still get into similar tuning loopholes just like with carbs.

I went another route and traded to a TPI car.

I want your thoughts on the difference

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philly

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