just curious what your choice in a defensive handgun would be and why?

Discussion in 'handgun related' started by Grumpy, Dec 23, 2015.

  1. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

    just a note Ive been using the holster pictured below from vedder holster with complete comfort,
    and the pistol remains secure, you easily forget its there, and its almost invisible under a loose shirt,
    and only one minor issue
    the clip retention screws
    over a few months you'll find the leather backing on the holster form fits to your hip contour
    yes youll want quality suspenders and belt keepers
    ComfortTuck IWB Hybrid by Vedder Holsters.html
    http://www.vedderholsters.com/comforttuck/
    if you can,t COMFORTABLY carry your handgun of choice all day/every day,
    you don,t have the correct holster, pistol or mindset!
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2020
  2. busterrm

    busterrm solid fixture here in the forum

    I chose my 40 cal for several reasons; 1. The power of the caliber, 2. The grip is larger and has 4 grips with it. 3.Double stack std mag has 13 rds and extended has 15rds. 4. It only has a trigger safety. If you are in a life threatening situation, a thumb safety or a grip safety could slow you down. 5. Most of all, it feels comfortable in my hands! Oh forgot, my holster is a 1791 leather holster and the weapon is a Smith & Wesson M&P Compact 40 cal.
     
  3. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

    [​IMG]

    just a note on quality and customer care:D

    As a few readers may remember,
    99.9% of the time,
    I carry a GLOCK model 20, caliber 10mm
    handgun concealed, most of the time in a VEDDER comfort tuck holster,
    well after several years of hard daily use,
    yes you'll want quality suspenders and belt keepers
    one of the riveted areas on my vetter holster broke,
    I called them and they said send it back here we would like to inspect it...
    I got a call a couple days later and they informed me after looking over the old holster,I shipped them,
    that they shipped me a new replacement holster free of charge
    its nice to see they stand behind the lifetime guarantee

    this is NOT a high dollar holster, but it is fully functional and has been for several years
    well worth the modest cost.
    [​IMG]


    https://www.vedderholsters.com/comforttuck-iwb-hybrid-holster/

    https://www.vedderholsters.com/contact-us/
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2020
  4. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member







    open link
    https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/self-defense-ammo-ballistic-tests/

    keep in mind energy transfer in clay blocks may be impressive,
    but any projectile impacting at high velocity can spray clay, block particles
    but its the combo and ratio between consistent and dependable penetration ,
    and repeatable energy transfer in the target ,
    after a few inches of penetration,
    that effective penetration best relates to effective lethality
    for a defensive pistol ,
    you generally want good accuracy out to a minimum of 25 yards ,
    and about an absolute minimum of 19"-22 " penetration in ballistic gel.
    any less and you won,t always get sufficient penetration,
    any more and you might risk hitting innocent people behind the target aggressor
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2020
  5. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member







     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2020
  6. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

  7. busterrm

    busterrm solid fixture here in the forum

    My GF chose a S&W M&P Sheild EZ 380. She tried my EZ 9mm, but it was just too big and awkward in her hand! We rented a 380 EZ, and it was a totally different story. She was more accurate with it, than I am with my EZ 9mm. Gees, it actually was kinda scary!
    I was reluctant, but she is very good with it! So, I am more confident, at least she has protection!
     
  8. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

    If you're selecting a handgun, yes its better to have something that fits you and something that you can easily shoot accurately.
    more power does you no good if you can't rapidly and accurately place shots on target.
    its a personal choice that should be best made after having experience and extensive practice
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2020
  9. rlphvac

    rlphvac reliable source of info

    I don't have a favorite in a one size fits all and I'm still and always will be in a search for the perfect carry gun a lot depends on what I'm wearing ,where I'm going and what I'm doing what I carry the most is a Sig 365 and around here in the winter time you can carry just about anything because you wear a coat and when I'm going out on the bike its pretty easy to carry about anything but I always have my ankle holster with a Glock 27 converted to 9mm but my favorite carry gun is a gun with a Decocker on it I like that a lot better than a safety you can carry with a round chambered and all you have to do is squeeze the trigger to fire
     
  10. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

    some suggested proven hand loads that WORK for self defense
    every load is a compromise, in these proven loads you get proven penetration to reach the attackers vitals and decent expansion.
    commercial hollow point bullets in the suggested weights with the suggested loads have a good track record
    no one in their right mind would want to be confronted with a lethal confrontation where they are forced to kill or be killed,
    but you might not have a choice and having the skill and knowledge and proven equipment may help you survive,
    if forced into that confrontation.
    the guy in the video that shot the first robber, one
    might have lived if he shot the first robber a few more times in very rapid succession and was more aware of what was going on around him,
    you can never assume a single hit is instantly lethal or going to totally incapacitate any attacker



    watch video
    https://www.concealedcarryuniversit...3974?cf_uvid=3eee8beb3826def12fb6ba51052e0ce6

    https://load-data.nosler.com/load-data/9mm-luger-parabellum/
    7.9 grains of blue dot under a a 124 grain hollow point

    https://www.shootersreference.com/reloadingdata/38-special/
    158 grain hard cast bullet over 5.1 grains of unique powder
    this is one pistol that seems best matched to hard cast bullets for max results

    https://fsreloading.com/lee-precision-mold-double-cavity-358-158-rf.html

    https://load-data.nosler.com/load-data/357-magnum/
    12 grains of Hercules 2400 under a 158 grain hollow point

    https://load-data.nosler.com/load-data/40-sw/
    10 grains of blue dot powder under a 155 grain hollow point

    https://load-data.nosler.com/load-data/10mm-auto/

    https://www.handloadermagazine.com/10mm-auto-pet-loads
    10 grains of BLUE DOT powder under a 180 grain hollow point

    https://www.handloadermagazine.com/loading-the-45-acp-pet-loads
    10.5 grains of blue dot under a 200 grain hollow point

    https://www.speer.com/bullets/handgun_bullets/

    https://www.hornady.com/bullets/handgun/#!/


    remember only hits to the vitals will be effective, hollow points have less penetration, but tend to destroy more tissue
    failure to break bones and/or destroy vitals may not stop an attacker.
    Ideally several rapidly placed hits to the vitals of any attacker are preferred
    remember its common for even lethal hits to take 10-20 seconds or more to be effective at stopping any attacker.

    BTW
    loads in larger or more powerful calibers like 41 mag, 44 mag, 480 Ruger,
    while proven effective, even with hollow point bullets
    are very likely to punch through and exit,
    seriously endangering people far beyond the intended target
    and increased recoil might slow your ability to make rapid and accurate follow up shots, this is where constant practice is required.

     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2021
  11. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

  12. rlphvac

    rlphvac reliable source of info

    Just a general question that I may have already asked in the past I do not carry with my handloads I've read up on this and it makes sense to me that if you get into a defensive shooting and the prosecutor learns that you are carrying a gun with ammo that you loaded yourself then you are a deranged killer and any other cannon fodder he can bring up
     
  13. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

    the most likely thing would be that you cover your butt, by simply stating you purchased the ammo at a local gun show if IF you were asked
    thats unlikely to happen, if you were justified in shooting in the first place, but its a common myth,
    yeah the KEY here legally is .. were you justified shooting... not in the ammo you used to defend yourself!
     
  14. rlphvac

    rlphvac reliable source of info

    I agree Grumpy you have to be legal on everything and its still going to get ugly and it makes sense both ways and you know and I know that because we might reload out rounds we are not crazed killers that I think the liberals want us to be
     
  15. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

    one factor I would put some thought into, into selecting a
    cartridge, caliber and load that won't tend to produce really excessive over penetration,

    you damn sure don't want to put a couple shots into some crazy bastard , and have the bullets zip through your obvious threat adversary,
    and take out some innocent bystander, like some gal in the next room beyond him,
    something which could easily happen with something like hard cast bullets in a 41 mag, 44 mag , or a 480 ruger , 500 mag,
    or any large powerful revolver with loads more designed for hunting then self defensive use.
    this is one of the main reasons I don't consider those valid defensive tools,
    not that they won't work very effectively in stopping an adversary ,
    if selectively used correctly in your trained hands,
    but that you can't control the time, place or conditions , where your forced to defend your self or family ,
    and you darn sure won't have unlimited time or options in many cases,
    example I know from using hard cast 170 grain bullets in a 357 mag,
    they are 100% accurate and lethal, but they exit even large hogs, so for defensive use they would be less than ideal


    one reason I think picking a cartridge and caliber/bullet that has 16-20" of ballistic jell penetration, as
    shown in the link below is a good choice, and one reason certain cartridges and loads have a good reputation

    https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/self-defense-ammo-ballistic-tests/#45ACP

    https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/self-defense-ammo-ballistic-tests/#40SW

    https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/revolver-ballistics-test/#38spl

    https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/10mm-auto-self-defense-ammo-ballistic-gel-tests/
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2021

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