renegade intake? for cross fires

Thanks, working my way through the thread.

I skipped a little to the end on your issues with pinging.

One thing i scoped out is a source for race fuel, i think its 110 octane if memory serves me. And its about a block away if all else fails :cool:

And i spent a good portion of the day running the digrinder. I think i did a pretty good job.

The exhaust port is pretty much mirror smooth now, the intake is smoothed out, but i left texture via my 80 grit rolls where i had to remove the casting texture.

I also noticed many bottle necks, i went light on them not wanting to change any port design that i dont understand, however during the blending and straightening of the ports i got a little bit more volume in both intake and exhaust...

I'll get some pictures tomorrow assuming i can stand lol
 
Thanks, working my way through the thread.

I skipped a little to the end on your issues with pinging.

I'm not sure who or what you are referring?

The exhaust port is pretty much mirror smooth now, the intake is smoothed out, but i left texture via my 80 grit rolls where i had to remove the casting texture.

I also noticed many bottle necks, i went light on them not wanting to change any port design that i dont understand, however during the blending and straightening of the ports i got a little bit more volume in both intake and exhaust...

I'll get some pictures tomorrow assuming i can stand lol

Yes ..... pictures will really be helpful to understanding your comments
 
lol sorry, in reply to Drawmain post right before my last one (end of page 5)
His build thread: http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/head-and-cam-swap-82-cfi.10412/
And the last little bit where he describes the difference in the way it was driving during break-in, I can't wait! :D

I was pretty dead last night, my lower back started to spaz out a bit at the end.

I also found my tripod, I'll get some good pictures shortly.

Also the head perfectly matched my felpro gasket, if I were to guess I would say edlebrock used it as a template when doing that bit of grinding at the mouth of the head.

in the intake what I saw was their finishing was to open the intake to match the gasket, however it was pretty obvious they did not go much into the intake other than to match the gasket. I worked to blend that in a bit better.

In the exhaust ports they did the same thing, and I noticed in the exhaust port, there is was pretty obvious where I could blend in better, most of my reading the last few days centered around porting and polishing the exhaust port.

For the intake I don't want to take it very much further until I understand more, and knowing these are the RPM castings, if I can find some detailed pictures of the RPM heads intake and exhaust it would give me a better basis.

anyways I very much enjoyed those cross buffs, they are a pleasure to work with, as I started to get the feel for the bits I really started enjoying blending and polishing. :cool:

I still need to take some after measurements, and then next I'll work to make sure the ports all have the same sizing.

I also had a little scare, I went to mock up the heads and intake to see how it all sat together, on my passenger side I found .003 gap when the head was laying on the block, I pulled the head and checked it with the straight edge and confirmed it was perfectly flat.

So I took the other head, and I found the same gap, so I rechecked the block and found it was flat...

After some thinking I cleaned up the positioning studs with a cross buff and found it now sits very flat... phew!
 
Pictures!

Here are some before pictures

You can kind of make out the bottle neck in these images.
upload_2015-11-15_11-3-8.png

upload_2015-11-15_11-10-44.png

upload_2015-11-15_11-12-29.png

Here I was checking the fit and snapped a quick picture, no tripod but you can see the exhaust port from a different angle
upload_2015-11-15_11-18-44.png

Some after images...

I did not want to totally re-shape the port so I went more for blending, the bottle neck is still present but not as pronounced as it was.

upload_2015-11-15_11-23-37.png
upload_2015-11-15_11-25-0.png

I need to revisit this exhaust port, however incase it's not clear on the bottle neck this might explain it a little better.

upload_2015-11-15_11-30-29.png

upload_2015-11-15_11-27-14.png
 
And I'm still debating on how polished I want to make the combustion chamber, mostly not wanting to lower the compression ratio.
Trying to focus more on preventing carbon from sticking...

I think I'll take it a little further, and I still need to round off the edge on the spark plug threads.
upload_2015-11-15_11-43-23.png


And my snapshot of the fitting test, looks much better than those old boring cast iron heads!
upload_2015-11-15_11-45-45.png

I'll save the polished intake for the final, for now it's all taped up to prevent scratches...

I'm also thinking I want to polish the exhaust port side of the head... it will make cleanup easier and since I have the polished intake... ;)
 
I think I'll take it a little further, and I still need to round off the edge on the spark plug threads.
CombChamber.JPG

Lots of nice pics .....thanks!

You can forget worrying about the CR and taking too much during polishing. It's going to
be less than 0.3 cc at the most. I would try and smooth the lines around the valves, especially
where it comes to a point between the two valves. Looks like a sure hot spot during WOT
runs. You run the chance of pre-ignition.

I think maybe I understand the choke point that you speak of, but I can't be sure unless you
point to it with a pen or maybe use a sharpie to color the area.
 
11-12-29z1.png

11-27-14z2.png

porting_e_heads.jpg

1217bn1.gif

1217bn2.gif

1217bn3.jpg


http://www.lcengineering.com/pdf/Head Porting DIY by Standard Abrasives.pdf

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-by-step-guide-with-pictures.5378/#post-32456

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...r-head-porting-tools-abrasives-sources.10683/

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/porting-can-help.462/page-2#post-24466

http://audisrs.com/archive/how-to-diy-gasflow-port+-polish-a-cylinder-head__o_t__t_15304.html

http://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsearch/result?q=die+grinder

nozzle.gif


p2636.jpg


6.5hpvac.jpg

http://www.amazon.com/Flashlight-Ultra-Bright-Headlight-Lightweight-Comfortable/dp/B00SR20JLS/ref=pd_sim_469_1?ie=UTF8&dpID=51gUm4lIJ2L&dpSrc=sims&preST=_AC_UL160_SR160,160_&refRID=1S6BXB7MPF62YB5NQDEB
hedlamp.png

faceshield2.jpg
 
Last edited:
Indy,
Thanks for the tip, I completed one head around the valves, I should get the other side done.

Grumpy,
Thanks, that's what I was looking for!
 
I won't get around to doing more headwork until this weekend, however I got a shipment notice for my headgasket! :cool:

Hopefully this weekend I can align everything and then start matching the intake to the head.
 
remember your NOT trying to significantly enlarger the port,or change the port shape drastically your goal is to remove, surface casting flash,irregularities,major machine marks and grooves and tooling marks and blend all the edges.

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/porting-can-help.462/
porting_e_heads.jpg

ideally ports look similar to this (below) when complete
cncport1v.jpg

p15831aa0_image_large.jpg

0210hpp_flow04.jpg

before as cast
portsd1.jpg

after port clean up intake
portsd2.jpg

before as cast
portse1.jpg

after port clean up exhaust
portse2.jpg
 
Ok i have the heads where im pretty happy with them.

I pulled the seals and picked up some valve grinding compound and i have #1 head seated and im now looking at springs.

For breakin i was hoping to use my oem springs from the other head, however they are pretty in diameter compared to the edlebrock springs.
Im starting to think i would be better off running the edlebrock springs for breakin...

And i started port matching the intake, i noticed some casting issues, the biggest worry is the water jackets.

Both front and rear are tiny, i did some opening of the port and both are about the diameter of a AA battery.
Mostly the front water jacked has me worried...

Think its worth while to open it up?
 
I would smooth everything as deep in intake ports as you can, in the exhaust side just behind the valve there may be a high spot that will restrict flow of the port into the headers. All 8 of mine had high spot there that I had to relieve. Pay attention to the transition from the hardend seat into the ports I had to open up all if mine. I think you will find more material to take out in the ports of the intake manifold then anywhere! I spent more time on the intake than the heads.
 
its basically wasted effort and counter productive to open the ports that are allowing access for coolant flow,between the heads and block, if your doing more than a mild de-burring and removing casting flash. WHY?
the head gaskets have carefully calculated openings that are designed to restrict coolant flow and in almost all cases the hole in the head gaskets are a bit smaller than the head gasket matching head or block casting port sizes
READING LINKS IN ALL THE THREADS HELPS ON THIS SITE
flowcon.png

Gasket1x.jpg

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/head-gasket-related.1859/#post-50617

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/block-prep.125/

bolthread.png
 
Last edited:
Thanks,

And looking over the intake again i do see a large pocket right below where tje thermostat sits, i feel much better after confirming that.

Ant the intake has a bit of a hump right over where the egr ports are...

I smoothed it out as much as i could but im thinking i need a more aggressive bit to mill it down a little flatter...

However my vintage sears hand me down 20 gallon air compressor is on its last leg.
I think it needs a new electric motor, however the price of a new motor is really close to the price of a new air compressor...

And over the summer i picked up a new in package tap set for a whopping $5 at an estate sale.

Last night i cleaned up the threads with it while using lots of penetrating oil. Then confirmed one of my new arp head bolts threaded all the way.

I als fitted my new copper head gasket, i did have to do a little trimming after testing fit on the head... I need to do a little more before its ready for install.
 
Ran into a small snag, first the cheap roller tip rockers have these lock nuts...

I attempted to reuse for the camshaft break in, found that the factory push rods had them sitting pretty good on the valve tip ect...
One of the lock nuts seized on the rocker stud, I ended up removing the stud and putting into a vice, I thought I was going to snap the swivel end of a craftsman wrench I had just exchanged but the rocker stud finally gave in and snapped.

So I ordered a new pair of edlebrock studs, and good thing, I found another stud had messed up threads from those stupid lock nuts... :rolleyes:

I also used the preform push rod checking tool http://www.summitracing.com/parts/pro-66789/overview/
It said I needed some pretty short push rods, even though it sounded off to I decided I would go ahead and make the order with my 1.65 ratio rocker arms.

I received everything last night, installed the new roller rocker on a valve with the check springs in place and found sure enough, way to short!

The factory push rods again are almost perfect, so this weekend I'll mock everything up with the adjustable pushrod and get the correct push rods ordered.

I also received a package from turn one, brand new seals, the had to bore out the rack and insert sleeves, after return shipping it was just a tad over $500.

I'm pretty excited, and I understand they know what they are doing so it should be just about perfect! :cool: (it's a very common issue in this vintage).

I also had a plan to check my piston to valve clearance using the 1.65 ratio, mostly involves cycling the engine, the valve checking springs, and my dial indicator.

My idea being that I can push down on the valves to contact the piston and using the dial indicator to tell me how much travel it takes past where the rocker arms place the valves...
 
http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/checking-piston-to-valve-clearances.399/

PtV3.jpg


every cam and engine combo will vary,
but piston to valve clearance is almost never the closest precisely at TDC ,
but usually some place between 30 degrees before too 30 degrees past TDC

degreewheeladapter.jpg

565pv-check1.jpg

Proform Parts 66830 - Proform Cam Checking Fixture Kits
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/pro-66830
pro-66830_cp.jpg

dialin11.jpg

and remove enough of the accessories to install a degree wheel and pointer on the crank.

cca-4790_w.jpg

cca-4914_w.jpg

RELATED THREADS
viewtopic.php?f=52&t=966

viewtopic.php?f=52&t=90
 
Ran into a small snag, first the cheap roller tip rockers have these lock nuts...
Don't remember, what rockers did you buy? Makes you wonder if one will come
apart early.

I also used the preform push rod checking tool http://www.summitracing.com/parts/pro-66789/overview/
It said I needed some pretty short push rods, even though it sounded off to I decided I would go ahead and make the order with my 1.65 ratio rocker arms.
Got pics of the process. Lots of people have used those.......just saying politely or
trying to anyway!

I also received a package from turn one, brand new seals, the had to bore out the rack and insert sleeves, after return shipping it was just a tad over $500.
Expensive, but worth every penny I'm sure!

I also had a plan to check my piston to valve clearance using the 1.65 ratio, mostly involves cycling the engine, the valve checking springs, and my dial indicator.
It's not quite that simple. If you could read the dial indicator, push down on the valve
until contacts the piston for the 30° before and after TDC, now that might work. You
might have the right idea, but you didn't explain with enough detail that we could tell
for sure. We can't assume that you are going to do something so very important, so
error on the conservative side and call your hand on it ...... sorry.
 
Back
Top