some higher quality scopes

[Grumpy]

http://precisionrifleblog.com/2013/...scopes-buyers-guide-and-features-to-look-for/

http://www.reloaderaddict.com/nightforce-vs-leupold-scopes-review/

http://www.zeiss.com/sports-optics/en_us/hunting/riflescopes.html

http://www.nikonsportoptics.com/en/nikon-products/scopes/index.page

http://www.usoptics.com/

https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2015/6/11/steiner-optics-german-innovation-on-the-rise/
high quality scopes, (Leopold, Nikon, Zeiss, Steiner ) proper install procedures and the better quality scope mounts goes a long way toward reducing problems
you don,t need to buy the most expensive mounts or rings but a decent quality mount is critical.
IVE never yet had a properly installed weaver style base and rings fail, loc-tite on clean de-greased, and properly tightened, screw threads helps

https://shop.brownells.com/optics/r...MI-fyIgLi12QIVmbXACh3gcQOeEAQYASABEgJTs_D_BwE

https://shop.brownells.com/optics-m...MI-fyIgLi12QIVmbXACh3gcQOeEAQYASABEgJTs_D_BwE

Ive seen lots of cheap mounts fail
http://www.cybermonday2015.co/Steiner Scope?origin=google&google_params[matchtype]=b&google_params[network]=g&google_params[device]=c&google_params[creative]=90205158138&google_params[keyword]=steiner scope&google_params[adposition]=1o1&google_params[adgroupid]=22157620578&google_params[campaignid]=319927578&rme=t&dest=0&sys_id=0|57&gclid=CNiuve3g-80CFYsCaQodjf0JbQ
Id remind anyone looking to purchase an accurate dependable hunting rifle that youll want high quality optics and rock solid scope mounts, the best rifle available will be seriously hampered if its not matched to clear and solidly consistent optics!
one of the most common failures I've seen over the decades was not related to the basic rifle function (although that did on occasion happen) but much more commonly loose scope mounts or cheap optics that failed to retain zero or fogged.
for most hunting you don,t need some huge high magnification scope , what you need is decent quality and rock solid dependability.
the newer LEOPOLD and NIKON 30mm tube size scopes are mostly an excellent value for the price.
yes theres hundreds of options, but if your looking for a good value Id suggest you want to select one with top quality optics for the price, a 30mm tube and 50mm front lens in a well known respected brand is a good start point for good low light transmission and clear target,vision. something similar to these linked below would provide an excellent match to a deer or elk rifle to be used for precise shot placement with most reasonable caliber elk/deer rifles, set on the lowest setting they allow you to make very rapid and accurate shots, if you have the time to get a solid field position, jack the magnification up as required.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1362146064/leupold-vx-r-rifle-scope-30mm-tube-3-9x-50mm-matte

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1...aff-7-rifle-scope-30mm-tube-25-10x-50mm-matte

https://www.opticsplanet.com/v/12325-browning-blr-scout-style-mount.html

https://ads.midwayusa.com/product/519551/weaver-6-hole-weaver-style-rings-matte?utm_medium=shopping&utm_source=google&utm_campaign=Optics - Scope Rings, Bases, Mounting & Accessories&utm_content=519551&cm_mmc=pf_ci_google-_-Optics - Scope Rings, Bases, Mounting & Accessories-_-Weaver-_-519551&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIq6X4zMqA2QIV2brACh0otQ2aEAQYAiABEgIgfPD_BwE

https://ads.midwayusa.com/product/917995/weaver-surethread-adhesive-10-ml
most modern quality scopes are far better than they used to be, but there are some advantages to buying the larger objective lens and newer 30mm tube designs.
if you've ever taken a scope like one these out at dusk too actually compare how clear the details are you can see, you might be amazed at the difference between the scopes similar to these compared to the older 1" tube and smaller lens size scopes, the newer scopes are a quantum leap in quality over the scopes available even 10-15 years ago.
If you get the chance take out several rifles with different optics , out at dusk and look at fine details on something like a fence at even 150 yards, the difference in the finer detail you can see in less than ideal lighting will astound you!
(this may not seem that important as most scopes look crystal clear in some well lighted store, but if your still hunting the thick timber at dawn or dusk it makes a world of difference if your trying to figure out if your looking at antlers or branches in the lodge pole timber

in my experience youll get about 90% of your shots looking like these, at under 200 yards rather than game standing out in a well lighted field

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1362146064/leupold-vx-r-rifle-scope-30mm-tube-3-9x-50mm-matte

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1...aff-7-rifle-scope-30mm-tube-25-10x-50mm-matte
decent quality optics are mandatory
https://www.midsouthshooterssupply....x42mm-30mm-tube-nikoplex-reticle-matte-finish

http://www.schmidtundbender.de/en/products.html

http://nightforceoptics.com/

 

[Dave]

You forgot Steiner too...

 

[Grumpy]

your correct, I fixed that

 

[RYG11]

You can also add this review buyer's guide and top rifle scopes review to your list: http://reloadyourgear.com/best-rifle-scopes/

 

[rlphvac]

I bought a Vortex Crossfire II to try one out and I'm impressed with what I see and the reviews were good

 

[Grumpy]

thank you!
the quality of many of the scope brands has improved dramatically over the last 45 years and theres many fairly new or recent vendors and manufacturers.
I'm not impressed with some of the older name brands as a few have made little effort at improving the quality,
I won,t go into brands but some of the older brand names don,t stand behind their warranties , they get out of it by demanding proof of purchase receipts
(who keeps a sales reciept for 20-40 years on what was originally sold with a life time warranted scope.
but that does not apply to all of the older name brands. on the plus side theres been huge quality improvements in some brands
I will point out NIKON , has impressed me with the major improvements they made, while keeping the cost semi reasonable
there have always been better quality and higher cost scopes like STIENER, NIGHTFORCE,ZEISS,and leopold

 

[rlphvac]

I read a few gun forums and know of some of the brands you speak of I have a couple $500.00 range scopes on a couple of my better rifles some of the others I have scopes in the $200.00-$300.00 range and I know there is a difference but I can't really tell them apart even in the dusk and dawn. A few years ago a friend of mine bought the exact same gun as mine with a scope included in the package deal it was just about dark and I grabbed my gun to look at it then I looked through his thats when I really learned the difference between a good scope and a not so good scope

 

[Grumpy]

yes a decent higher quality scope thats correctly designed can easily add an additional 15-20 minutes of usable lighting,
too accurately place your shots that a lower quality scope would never allow !
Id also point out that if you get into elk and deer hunting youll find many states demand you only shoot a game animal with a certain antler configuration,
you could be heavily fined or loose your licence for years if you shoot the wrong animal and at low light conditions or at extended ranges a quality scope will allow you to easily see the differences between a 4 or 3, or five point antler configuration, something else that a lower quality optic may not be able to easily show you.
Id also point out that durability is a huge issue and yes you do tend to get as much more durable components, now no scope will last long under abusive conditions but your kidding yourself if you don,t think you wont slip and fall or drop your rifle, eventually and youll stand a much better chance if a scope surviving and retaining its sight zero if its got solid quality mounts and its fairly short and you don,t have the length to provide a lot of leverage between the scope rings and the end of the scope, and of course metallurgy and the quality of the lenses and internal components do tend to be better on most of the better brand name scopes , particularly if you select a basic design like a shorter length 30mm 3x-9x with a 50mm bell
something like this, with decent mounts like these and with proper hardened screws with loc-tite on the threads is very unlikely to come loose if properly installed

IVE never yet had a properly installed weaver style base and rings fail, loc-tite on clean de-greased, and properly tightened, screw threads helps

a 150/400 watt gun makes soldering much easier

BTW red loc-tite is a thermally sensitive bonding agent,
if you need to remove scope mount screws, or any screw locked in place with this thread binding agent, that were locked in place with red loc-tite simply hold a high wattage soldering iron firmly against the screw head for at least 2 minutes before you try to remove it, this allows heat to travel through the screw and melt the bonding plastic based locking agent

decent quality optics are mandatory
https://www.midsouthshooterssupply....x42mm-30mm-tube-nikoplex-reticle-matte-finish

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply....ended-skeletonized-30mm-ar-mount-(skel)-black

yes there are better scope mounts but these are something I see used frequently

 

[Grumpy]

put something like these see through mounts, on a 375 H&H sako carbine,

like I've used for decades,
(Jack used to say that if your not spending at least 1/3 -1/2 of the price you spent your rifle on matching quality,
optics, and mounts, your probably selecting the wrong scope)
(RON, used to laugh at that, but he eventually agreed)
I think thats a reasonable guide line
and you,ll be lucky to have it hold zero,you don,t need a great deal of magnification, what you need is clear optics that hold your zero dependably, Id select a high quality 2.5x or 4x rather than a 4x-12x that was significantly lower quality, You need a bright clear image, you don,t necessarily need high magnification, simply because I rarely see elk past 350 yards in the field simply because elk are rather reluctant to come out of the timber in bright sun-light after opening day,
on a week long elk hunt, any elk rifle, and its scope and mounts takes constant stress from handling, being carried, just from normal handling issues

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply....0ds/target-10-40x50mm-18-moa-dot-matte-finish

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/3...e-scope-30mm-tube-5-20x-50mm-side-focus-matte
high quality scopes, (Leopold, Nikon, Zeiss, Steiner ) proper install procedures and the better quality scope mounts goes a long way toward reducing problems
you don,t need to buy the most expensive mounts or rings but a decent quality mount is critical.
IVE never yet had a properly installed weaver style base and rings fail, loc-tite on clean de-greased, and properly tightened, screw threads helps

https://shop.brownells.com/optics/r...MI-fyIgLi12QIVmbXACh3gcQOeEAQYASABEgJTs_D_BwE

https://shop.brownells.com/optics-m...MI-fyIgLi12QIVmbXACh3gcQOeEAQYASABEgJTs_D_BwE
https://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-...head-scope-ring-base-screw-kit-prod41830.aspx

https://www.opticsplanet.com/burris-xtreme-tactical-30mm-rings.html

torx head screws tend to be better strength and quality,

Ive seen lots of cheap mounts fail

see through combo mount and scope rings are not all high quality and many tend to allow a scope to loosen over time as the increased height allows greater leverage on the retention screws, while the idea of easy access to iron sights seems sound buying good optics and a solid mount system tends to prevent the issue that might benefit from the taller mounts

keep in mind you may only get the time off from work or family obligations, and available, cash saved up, too hunt out of state in a good quality area,
loaded with big legal elk, a few times in a decade,
and the last thing you want is to wait several years and to spend $3K-$7K on an elk hunt, you waited years to enjoy, in licences, various fees, transportation, food, maybe a motel, maybe a guide and you take the only shot you get on that trip, is at 300 yards on a early 10 deg F morning and you find your rifle won,t hold its zero because its scope mounts or the scopes internal lenses ETC. came apart, or the scope leaked internally and moisture formed fog on the internal lense surfaces, as the scope was damaged, just from sitting in its padded gun case as it sat in the back seat of your guides pick-up truck as he drove over hours of pot-hole dirt roads or you dropped the rifle when you leaned it against a tree for 15 seconds while you tied your shoe laces.
and yes I know from my friends experiences things like that happen all to often!
I know several guys that think nothing of spending $6K on an elk hunt and $2K on a rifle who then to my amazement purchased a $240 scope and $30 mounts and assumed they were all set!...... and yes they were kicking themselves for years after that fiasco !MURPHY LOVES ELK HUNTS!

 

[Grumpy]