upgrading your c4 to c5 brakes

Over the weekend i tossed the brake caliper/pad brackets into the bead blaster to clean them up.
Then i did some minor casting cleanup on both the brackets and the calipers to ensure it's easy to keep the brakes looking pretty.

Dissembled the calipers, painted to match my front brakes.

The wife then left for a few hours to go shopping, so i saw my chance.
Into the oven @ 350 for about 2 hrs.

This will prevent the paint from being damaged when i reinstall the pinstons and new seals due to the brake fluid I'll use for lube...
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I would not eat out of that oven until it was cleaned and reheated for several hours. Harmful to your health.
Get a used oven and put in the garage for powder coating and paint baking.
 
Good point, it did make my oven smell funny.
Deep scrub and a self cleaning cycle and it's back to normal.

That oven is also a two level, i used the level that serves as storage for pans... lol

I now have everything i need except for the adapter.
I do have some scrap left over from the front caliper bracket that might work.

As for the parking brake, there is a very good chance that i may need to do a custom brake lining on the oem shoes.

I found i can buy the material off of ebay, or i can send the shoes out to have them install the friction material to my specs.

I watched a few vids on youtube on how to do it, I'm tempted to give it a try, using rivets to secure the liner...

Also winter hit here, i doubt that I'll touch this until spring since the motorhome interrior is currently in the garage... lol
 
Good point, it did make my oven smell funny.
Deep scrub and a self cleaning cycle and it's back to normal.

That oven is also a two level, i used the level that serves as storage for pans... lol

I now have everything i need except for the adapter.
I do have some scrap left over from the front caliper bracket that might work.

As for the parking brake, there is a very good chance that i may need to do a custom brake lining on the oem shoes.

I found i can buy the material off of ebay, or i can send the shoes out to have them install the friction material to my specs.

I watched a few vids on youtube on how to do it, I'm tempted to give it a try, using rivets to secure the liner...

Also winter hit here, i doubt that I'll touch this until spring since the motorhome interrior is currently in the garage... lol

You can still buy the linings of any width and most lengths. I would carry them to a truck shop repair place and they would rivet them on for free for me. then I would just shape the ends in a bevel to control (squealing) and seat them by backing up and using the parking brake.

If you can get the asbestos ones, they will stop the car a lot better than the mineral ones you will usually get. Dangerous I know, but if you work with the brake cleaning fluids and water to hold down the dust, you will survive.
 
Acouple months ago I did c6 z51 brakes on my early c4, ended up buying a powder coat kit so now can coat from home, my buddy gave me a smoker to use as a oven and will hold 400 degree temp and works well, thought about tring ceroketo next but will see. Only problem ran into was my 17in rims did not fit and had to put 18s on to clear but all and all nice upgrade, I also changed the bais spring in master cylinder. For the front used c6 z51 rotors and c6 z51 mounting brackets and in the back is c6 z51 rotors but use base calipers. Attached a few photos of after sandblasted and powder coat before and after cooking. And just coated whole front calipers then just took a cookie wheel and cleaned the powder coat off the Corvette lettering. Now I'm starting to powder coat everything lol.
 

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And then had a guy make me center cap decals for a c4 to replace the c6 logos. Came out good.he prints out the decal than fills it with a resin so it ends up being domed and very good work. Hes out of ny.
 

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I was originally planning on building my own adapters, however after spending a few hours and making a template out of wood...
I started digging more for a shape that works, and to get an idea how much work this will really be.

So I noticed a fresh listing on ebay: https://www.ebay.com/itm/13334228300...m=133342283002
Seller: 1976ls1
Note that he also has parking brake shoes available for a separate price that have been modified to work with the upgraded rotors, message him for details.
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Lists his adapters to work with the C6 Z51 13" rear brakes.

So I started asking him some questions, he was very responsive and helpful.

In the end, I decided that if I put a price on my time vs how much these cost me, I end up ahead.
And I very much like the idea of having 13' in rotors up front, and 13' rotors in the back.
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So I made the purchase.

I received the package in the mail, and started tinkering and to make sense of the instructions.

What I ended up with,

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So I had originally planned on going with C5 rear brakes, so I had the C5 rear calipers, brackets, and rotors.
Chatting with the seller, he told me that the only real difference between the C6 Z51 calipers and the C5 base is the piston size.
With the C5 having the larger piston.


So since I have the C5 rears already, lets take a look at sizing differences.

Original 84 Rear Rotor on top of the C5 Rear rotor

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C4 rear rotor vs the C6 Z51!
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Next issue, the kit is meant to mount to a later knuckle with a 12mm bolt.
My 84 has a 10mm mounting bolt.

I did a little measuring with a dial caliper, and decided I have plenty of material to keep this safe.
I found I did not quite have the right size drill, and with a hand drill it's likely to do some grabbing/damage to the hole.
Enter my die grinder with sand paper rolls from Summit Racing!
(Well used!)
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I went slow, ensuring I kept a nice round circle.
Used the included 12mm bolt to check the hole front and back as I went.
Once I had it close, I used the fine grit paper roll to fit the bolt nice and snug.

modified hole picture.
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As for the parking brake shoe, I'll go more into detail there a little later.
However, this is a modified set sitting inside of the drum.

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I ran into one very confusing thing with the included instructions.
There is this sorta thick washer with some red coloring on it, instructions show that the washer goes on "this side only" and has two arrows.
What I found is the washer only goes on the lower bolt...

Instructions with some red pen love...

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Washer installed on the car

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Then the parking brake cable bracket needs to be trimmed to make room for the caliper bracket mounting bolts..
This is my first attempt, the second attempt opened the lower cut a little more..

Also airtools are the shit.
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Also, the instructions specified that i was to trim the dust shield.
i noticed that it did not block anything, other than a mounting bolt...

my solution.
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Also I had some issues with a thin piece of what appeared to be stainless steel.
It looks like it's for the parking brake shoes.
When I took the shoes off, I noticed that one side had come undone at the bottom, and was folded up behind the shoe.
When reinstalling the shoes it made it a serious PITA.

I finally ripped one side off, and then the other side.
Once they were gone, life became much easier!

I drew the shim looking thing out in red pen.
Any side affects with me removing this?

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Parking brake shoe mod.
Here is a pre drilled shoe, pad material covered with tape to prevent the epoxy from soaking into the pad material.

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I could not get an image of me doing the rivets, epoxy + gloves = pita.
But here it is clamped up to cure.

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Fresh off of the clamps!
Sitting next to an un modified shoe.

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And the set ready to install,
I used some caliper paint since this side had some rust that needed some sanding.

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Modified shoes installed!

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Here is a before image with the stock 84 brakes and 18in wheels.

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Here is an after image with the C6 Z51 brakes.

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I ended up painting the entire rotor face with caliper paint to prevent rusting and the classic rust ring where the pad does not ride...

Once cured, I had a chance to test the brakes, and to get some of that caliper paint worn off of the face.
Man I can really feel a difference in the braking, and I still have the old unknown history brake pads installed!
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I drove the car a bit and I have 99% of the paint off of the surface, and the brakes are very noticeable in the back.

I went out and braved the chance of getting the corona virus and picked up a new set of rear brake pads.

Pending install of the new pads.

And the car looks pretty good IMO.
Not the best picture of the car + rear brakes, but it's there!

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One step closer to having the car driving like I want it.

And then the ammo, was not sure if it was politics or just the upload_2020-3-20_22-28-8.png virus hording scare, but I took inventory and decided I better top off some of my supplies. :rolleyes:

My plan was to finish my rear end out with banski strut rods, and maybe buy my self a shiny new present for my bday in a few weeks.
I pretty much gave up hope of that 500 S&W going on sale and was ready to pounce. :(

Oh well, at least I can enjoy my current pew pew toys this summer. :cool:
 
right now may not be the ideal time, but in a few months time,
Id start calling pawn and gunshops if you want a lightly used (many cases shot less than a box of ammo,)
500 S&W revolver at a decent discounted price
Im sure they will be available if the economy keeps taking a hit due to the virus,
Im sure more than a couple were purchased without the new owner ever checking the price of ammo or having any concept of the potential recoil levels.
obviously, if you handload
,you can customize the ammo to match your needs,
and reduce cost and recoil levels significantly.

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...do-i-need-here-for-a-500-s-w-reloading.11917/
 
@Indycars I hope this helps someone out, for me that parking brake detail was the deciding factor in the conversion. ;)

@Grumpy
From what I have been reading, the recent lack of guns and ammo are libs that have started on their journey to the "dark side" with the recent quarantine stuff.
Good for them, hopefully we got some solid converts out of this.

I was at a local large chain sporting goods store that recently merged with another large chain with bass in their name.
They had a very pretty 500 sparkling in the case at me.
If the wife was not with me, it might have followed me home.

I know the wife would have been fine, especially since she gave me the green light to buy myself a new firearm after having to put down a beloved pet a few weeks ago...
She knows a new pew pew always lifts my sprits. :)

But I needed to focus on feeding my current toys.
 
also @Grumpy
I have seen a few slightly used 500's for sale.
Most of the time I might get a $100 off of the new sale price, however they usually come with a 20rd box of ammo with 18rds in it. :rolleyes:
and then a holster that I would never buy my self...
I can only imagine what happened there. :D

A pawnshop might be the best bet, I'll have to give that a try.
If I can score one for under $900 used and with a profile I like, that would be a win.
Usually I can find them for about 1000 new, but then you have sales tax on top of it.
At the large chain with high prices, they had one I liked that was $1250 iirc.

It's probably going to happen sooner than later, the fact that I can reload the deagle and the 500 with the same bullets, primers. and powder is a huge plus.
:cool:

anyways, this probably belongs in the other section. :oops:
 
I had a chance to take the car for a nice drive after seating the new pads, and so far it's very good.
I'm thinking i need to pull my DRM brake bias spring that I installed for the old rear brakes, in favor of the original.
Right now it feels a little biased towards the rear.

When installing the final pads, i decided to try something different..
Painted the back of the brake pads with red caliper paint.

I'm liking my choice, makes the rear calipers look bigger IMO.

Picture at the top of one of my favorite canyon roads
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Zoom in on the rear wheel
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Im sure other members would like to hear your thoughts,
now that youve done the up-grade,
could you summarize or add any more insite?
BTW THANKS FOR POSTING THE PICTURES AND INFO:D
how long did the brake upgrade take you to do?
were there any problems you found, that you failed to mention, earlier, doing the up-grade?
any issues finding or fitting the required parts you might have failed to mention earlier ?
about how much cash was required to buy the parts to do the job?
where did you source the adapters and parts required?
 
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So far I'm loving the brakes, much firmer, and i can really feel it pulling on the back brakes when i hit the pedal.
Feels more like a modern vehicle imo.
I did notice that having the extra power on the rear brakes felt different when at speed and entering a turn, something I'm still getting use to.
Almost like the backend pulled.
Something that's not bad, but when I'm going over 80, i don't want surprises. :D

I still need to finish off the rear end of the car as well, I'm not a fan of the poly trailing arm bushings... shiny things got in the way. ;)

Cash involved, the most expensive thing was that brake adapter kit.
Me deciding to not build my own cost a bit of money.
I believe it was close to $200 just for the kit.
I got the brake calipers on ebay, used and dirty.
those were about $80 for the set iirc.
then another $13 for new seals, actually ended up as a freebee since the ebay seller took a very long time. I canceled the order and they sent anyways.
Result = refund!

I used the brake lines that came with the calipers, those will get replaced later down the road.

One thing that i had an issue with, i thought the calipers were marked right and left.
They are not.
Key point, keep that bleed screw at the highest point!
bleeding does not go well if you put them on upside-down :rolleyes:

I used the C5 brake lines front and rear on my car.
Uses the original hose brackets, i just needed to notch out the bracket as the C5 lines are backwards from the C4 lines.
Also a nice thing since there are better choices for the C5 hoses.

The biggest thing for this swap was the choices of brake pads it gives me.
Affordable and locally available.
Rotors are the same, nice options, good prices vs the stock 84 stuff.

Also my parking brake works fantastic, better than the stock one.
I think more surface area + the material i used was a bit softer than the hard stuff that was oem.
I gave a tug on my parking brake while moving, it really grabs now!
Not something i want to do too often. :eek:

The single most confusing thing i marked above with a red arrow that loosely looks like a penis and balls.
Instructions are not very clear, the double arrows the seller used = o_O

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great!:D
THANK YOU!
I REALLY appreciated the added info and insight!
 
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