what AR 15 version would you consider..

Discussion in 'Tactical & Black Rifles' started by Grumpy, Jun 30, 2016.

  1. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

    If your main goal was to purchase a AR15 ,either a NIB, rifle from some manufacturer, or assemble a collection of NEW sub assemblies, (upper receiver, lower receiver groups or starting from a 80% lower etc.)
    I want to build a semi auto 223. target rifle based on the AR 15 design
    ,
    built too roughly mil specs ,with ease of parts, replacement,, built for, high accuracy,
    and I wanted a rifle with an 8:1 twist, rate, 20"-24" chrome lined barrel for durability,
    like the COLT H-BAR version.
    yes the shorter carbine version is probably more popular but in my opinion you give up,
    a lot of accuracy and range for that reduction in weight and length.

    what AR 15 version would you consider..,
    the problem I have here is I can,t seem to find any current AR-clones or Colt h-bars for sale that are in new condition, priced under, about $1400.
    , which I think is about the reasonable financial limit,
    being easily almost triple what you can build a basic AR clone for.
    keep in mind the better quality heavy barrel AR15 designs can keep 5 shots in a 25 cent quarter, size coin at 100 yards off a bench rest with decent ammo, thats far more accurate than the rather typical 3"-6" group a typical AK 47 clone will produce, even the standard ar 15 will frequently produce a 1.2"-1.5" group off a solid rest allowing lethal accuracy too noticeably greater ranges than the typical AK, which has the power but not the required accuracy.
    in fact in IRAQ so many islamic terrorists were shot in the head that an inquiry was started on the fear that marines were simply executing enemy combatants, but it was found that the only body part the terrorists exposed was their face when shooting at our troops, from behind cover in buildings, hence the higher number of head wounds, simply because, thats the only target the marines had to shoot back at.


    http://gunblast.com/AR15_HBARs.htm

    http://www.midwayusa.com/general.mvc/index/how-to-build-ar-15-rifle

    http://www.ar15-kits.com/

    https://www.stagarms.com/model-6-super-varminter/

    https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/pro...-black-free-floating-handguard-2-rraar0550.do

    http://www.ar15gunkits.com/contents/en-us/d1_AR15kits.html

    http://blackthorneproducts.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=275

    https://www.model1sales.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/product.display/product_id/151/index.cfm

    while the 223 rem can be fired in most 5.56 mm rifles the chambers are not identical nor the pressure levels , so firing the higher pressure 5.56 mm ammo in a 223 rem is not always a good idea

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/com...firearms-ar15-5-56-rifle-detail.html?Itemid=0

    https://ar15depot.com/barrels.htm/a...fluted-threaded-bull-1-8-twist-barrel-24-st25

    http://www.basspro.com/Bushmaster-Varminter-Rifle/product/14062009563269/
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2018
  2. 87vette81big

    87vette81big Guest

    I prefer hand guns Grumpy.
     
  3. T-Test

    T-Test Well-Known Member

    You are correct on the costs of Colts and like Mfg rs That is why I use 80% receivers and buy a complete upper assy of various Mfg rs, depending on barrel length and such, as stated in your msg. Lately I have been buying lower parts kits that have the trigger assy in one piece with a 3 1/2 lb trigger pull. Anderson-Bear Creek-LWR- and others have good deals if you look for them.
    Yes, it costs a little more to build your own gun, but the no required back ground checks or serial numbers mean more to me. $1000.00 would get you a home built rifle in 223 Wylde that shoots the 556 also with a 24"/28" barrel chrome lined and twisted chrome or nitrided barrel. Any twist you want for target shooting. . Easily do able.

    Why buy an off the shelf AR for $519.00 when you can build the same one without paper work or back ground check for $550.00, and the Gvmt not know about it and it's all legal to do and easy as turning brake rotors/drums on a lathe. My milling machine and lathe help me build anything I want or need along with the Millermatic welder w/spool gun and oxy/acetylene outfit as well as bending brakes, planishers, bead rollers and various hydraulic benders.

    Am working on a 45 auto now on the milling machine, 87vette81 big[​IMG] Home built with 80% lower with name brand on it. Rare![​IMG] .Goose neck hitch that I built to go in my truck. Fuzzy pic.[​IMG] Less than $1100.00 in both. Anodized in clear w/ plain aluminum finish. NO Government over watch on these[​IMG] Store bought for $600.00. Not my cup'o tea,but the grand daughter wanted it. .
     
  4. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

    can you post several links to where you buy the various component parts, like lower and upper assemblies, barrel options carrier options receiver styles and provide a bit more details, any and all info and links would be helpful here
    I know many guys are clueless on the options that are reading through this thread and the info may be enormously helpful.
    as with most things theres a big difference in QUALITY between the better name brand components and the cheap import clone parts available so time spent in research is not wasted effort

    https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/pro...559001254.do?sortby=ourPicks&refType=&from=fn

    https://www.slickguns.com/product/anderson-predator-ar-15-66499-499-sh

    https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/category/firearms/rifles/ar-lower-receivers.do?sku_instock_b=true

    http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/top-10-ar-15-rifles-2014/

    http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/ar-15-barrels-101/

    http://daytonatactical.com/

    http://www.milzap.com/

    http://core15rifles.com/ar-15-lower-parts-kit-99599.html

    http://core15rifles.com/parts/lower-parts/internal-parts-kits/

    http://mapartsinc.com/shop/?iCat=20&iSubOne=381&iSubTwo=486

    http://mapartsinc.com/shop/?iCat=20&iSubOne=381

    http://www.brownells.com/rifle-part...ar-15-lower-receiver-parts-kit-prod26400.aspx

    http://www.ar15.com/content/legal/AR15-M16Parts/index.html

    https://www.danieldefense.com/lower-receiver-parts-kit-semi-auto.html

    http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/index.htm

    http://www.tacticalmachining.com/80-products/80-ar15-lower-receivers.html

    http://www.80percentarms.com/

    https://www.80-lower.com/

    http://www.modulusarms.com/

    http://www.tacticalmachining.com/80-ar-15-lower-receiver.html
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2016
  5. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

    well? I thought at least a few of the members had purchased or assembled 223 caliber AR clones,
    but I'm rather surprised at the lack of response and info here??
    theres a great many options and a myriad of sources and I'm fairly sure I can eventually find a great deal on quality components at a good price
     
  6. 87vette81big

    87vette81big Guest

    Everyone that has an AR Wont talk about it online Grumpy.
    NSA & Bam.
    Bam wants to take them away.
    There long range defense.

    I am front line battle guy.
    Close Range.
    Hand to Hand Combat Fighting.
    Draw your Weapon.
    44 Mag like You.
     
  7. 87vette81big

    87vette81big Guest

    Only us from DC Can fight hand to hand & Win.
     
  8. T-Test

    T-Test Well-Known Member

    Sorry for no response, but I was in Indy at the NTBA Nationals. Drove my Bucket there and back. Don't know how to post links, but I'll try and give names of places tomorrow.
     
  9. 87vette81big

    87vette81big Guest

    The Guys in Joliet want to come to my Farmhouse and Target Practice Shooting Grumpy.
    Looking around Eds.
    Planning Strategic Shots in case SHTF.
     
  10. T-Test

    T-Test Well-Known Member

  11. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

  12. T-Test

    T-Test Well-Known Member

    Yes it is! There are great deals out there if you have time to look. I can spend 4 hours just looking up the best deal on specific parts that I need for a build/repair, and it would be the same part/s, just from a different supplier. I have almost a thousand Mfgrs, suppliers in my cache of favorites from around the world for any type of weapon you could possibly want or have a need to repair. Get on their E-Mail E-Deals to keep you up to date on their special sales. Some are over priced. Kinda like deer hunting in a way?
    Palmetto State has good deals on reloading supplies and equipment.
     
  13. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

    I purchased one of those 45 acp pistols years ago from EAA (the previous but almost identical version) and its easily the most accurate 45 acp pistol I own or have used,
    it did require some feed ramp polishing to function flawlessly with some hollow point ammo styles but that only took a few minutes with a dremel,tool and it always fed mil spec ammo flawlessly, in fact before they had a 10mm glock it was my preferred concealed carry pistol choice
     
  14. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member


    a rifle is simply a tool to accurately shoot projectiles, and like with most tools you'll want to think long and hard about what you'll use the tool for before purchasing one.
    AR15 rifles have become almost a lego or erector set rifle,
    in that you can order a custom list of features to match your intended application
    if you choose to stay with the basic 223/5.56 caliber,most of us will never use an AR15 in personal combat, so in most cases your looking for a target or hunting rifle version.
    your priority will generally not be shooting terrorists house to house, but maybe deer, or hogs at 50-150 yards, or prairie dogs at 100-450 yards.
    Id suggest a heavy weight fluted stainless 20"-24" barrel, is a good choice, if your intent is long range hunting accuracy or target work. in my opinion a rifle like the colt H-bar is a great compromise
    [​IMG]

    there are vendors that can supply you with a custom assembled AR15 clone, and if you shop carefully you have thousands of options
    https://www.model1sales.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=171
    as the extra length and barrel mass & rigidity, of a fluted stainless barrel, helps faster heat dissipation,
    and a heavier barrel generally helps you keep the barrel and sights steady from a good rest especially with a bi-pod
    if you want a light and handy carry rifle the shorter and lighter weight barrels make it easy to carry,
    [​IMG]
    the shorter and lighter weight, barrel, M4 carbine is easy to carry but it give up a bit of longer range velocity and accuracy/
    but accuracy tends to suffer once the rifle barrel heats up after a few shots and the shorter length reduces velocity,
    selecting options like hard chrome bolts and heavy stainless fluted barrels add reliability, frequent cleaning and lube maintenance helps and keeping the heat reasonably low by not firing long strings of closely spaced shots reduces wear.
    theres dozens of types of sights and forearm and stock configurations,
    youll want to select a high quality scope and decent scope mounts.
    don,t forget to pick-up, a dozen decent quality magazines , lots of good quality ammo, and a high quality cleaning kit,and a bi-pod and sling

    [​IMG]

    as with most things youll want to reach a compromise that suits your idea of the best choice.
    look at the rifle barrel twist rate,
    if you hunt or long range target shoot youll want a rifling 7:1-8:1 twist rate,
    to stabilize,
    the heavier 62 grain to--75 grain bullets
    with the more mass and better ballistics


    well proven bullet for deer and hogs from a 223 ar
    https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1...224-diameter-70-grain-semi-spitzer-box-of-100

    http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-viable-deer-hunting-caliber-and-rifle.12801/

    https://ar15depot.com/barrels.htm/a...fluted-threaded-bull-1-8-twist-barrel-24-st25

    related
    https://www.model1sales.com/

    http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/stag-arms-model-1-basic-ar-15-equipped-reliability/

    http://www.wideopenspaces.com/top-10-ar15s-money-pics/

    https://www.pewpewtactical.com/best-ar-15/

    http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/selecting-a-decent-hunting-scope.13506/

    http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...d-be-ideal-on-an-ar-15-for-general-use.12844/

    http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/bulk-ammo-sources.12454/

    http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-common-sense-storing-loaded-magazines.12465/

    http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-308-win-in-your-basic-defensive-rifle.12421/
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2018
  15. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

  16. Dave

    Dave Member

    I like and have a Colt M4 Carbine w/14" barrel and perm. pinned and welded Flash hider. All stock like the pic above.. Can mount bayonets..
    I also have a S&W 16" Carbine that I built from a S&W lower... W/light weight hand guard and Aimpoint sight and all the goodies.. Those are my go to rifles...
    I had but sold a 20" rifle that I wish I had still, But I'll get another one soon... Maybe build one... IDK...
     
  17. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

    [​IMG]
    I can,t explain a sudden urge to buy a new AR15, or similar rifle!
    it just came out of no-ware!

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2018
  18. Strictly Attitude

    Strictly Attitude solid fixture here in the forum

    Damn it Grumpy double porn next you will have them leaning on a hot rod with an AR
     
  19. Grumpy

    Grumpy The Grumpy Grease Monkey mechanical engineer. Staff Member

  20. JohnHancock

    JohnHancock Well-Known Member

    I’m not much of a rifle guy but I recently visited a friend in Ga. and we took his AR to the range to sight in his scope. He built it from parts and had a Bull Barrel installed. I shot it to set up the scope then hit an 11” target at 100 yards 8 out of 10 times. Seems to me the Bull Barrrel is a must!
     

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