Oil pump priming

Ronno6

Member
I have attempted to prime and pre oil the system in my 355 build
using the tool shown on Grumpy's stickys but am not sure if all is as it should be.
The filter was filled pre installation and the balance of the 5 quarts of oil poured
into the lifter valley.
The tool in inserted and run with a drill turning clockwise.
Oil comes surging up around the spool shaped part of the tool where it passes thru the lifter valley floor
and down to the pump.
This spool shaped part of the tool does not fit snugly into that hole (should it??)
Anyway, I have yet to see oil at the rockers.
I have not connected a pressure gauge (gotta get one) but oil does come out the gauge port if not plugged.
It does not squirt out of that hole as if under pressure.

Am I not holding my mouth correctly??
 
the lower spool shape part of the oil pump primer tool forms part of the oil passage walls in the area of the lifter gallery, if its inserted to the correct depth,
its designed to be a very close tolerance fit , if it does not fit snugly its generally designed to use o-rings (aftermarket) but it should be a fairly close fit (O.E.M.) to the block walls,
if its properly located
it is designed to leak a bit of pressurized oil to keep the distributor & cam gear bathed in oil,the clearance is designed to leak pressurized oil on the cam/distributor gear, O.E.M. distributors are a close tolerance fit that limits oil leakage, aftermarket distributors can be designed too use O-rings and have a hole drilled to direct pressurized oil to the cam/distributor gear contact area.


distriboila.jpg
OilingModForGear04_5229

oiltofilter.png
sbcoilh5a.jpg

p167352.jpg
every time I see guys using LATHES AND MILLS I get jealous,
as they make this hobby so much more enjoyable


oes-27060a.jpg

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-901015?rrec=true
welding a 3/8" drive deep well socket,
deepso.jpg

bitr.jpg

deepso.jpg

or thread rod nut,
51RFjzUe0VL._AC_UL320_.jpg

to the upper end of the primer tool makes use of an air ratchet far easier
sum-901010

PrimeTool800.JPG

I can see a few oil pump primers, made from old distributor bodies, that might not have the necessary length to allow its use.
SBColprimer.jpg

distriboilpassage.jpg

the lower spool shape part of the oil pump primer tool forms part of the oil passage walls in the area of the lifter gallery, if its inserted to the correct depth,
its designed to be a very close tolerance fit , if it does not fit snugly its generally designed to use o-rings (aftermarket) but it should be a fairly close fit (O.E.M.) to the block walls,
if its properly located
it is designed to leak a bit of pressurized oil to keep the distributor & cam gear bathed in oil,the clearance is designed to leak pressurized oil on the cam/distributor gear, O.E.M. distributors are a close tolerance fit that limits oil leakage, aftermarket distributors can be designed too use O-rings and have a hole drilled to direct pressurized oil to the cam/distributor gear contact area.


distriboila.jpg


oiltofilter.png



distrib-o-ring.jpg

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/oil-pump-primer.6150/#post-19099

 
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Mine is the blue one above.
The lower flange of the spool fits down into the bore, but the upper flange does not enter.
A significant amount of oil surges out of that area. Should the upper flange enter that bore
when installed?
I don't see as that is adjustable.......
 
the upper flange is designed to maintain proper alignment with the oil pump drive,
the lower spool forms much of the lifter gallery oil passage wall,
I obviously don;t know how fast the priming tool is being spun,
or how much torque is applied to the oil pump drive shaft.
but if you spin the oil pump drive continually , and reasonably fast and remove all the spark plugs temporarily,and
have a buddy with a breaker bar on the crank damper bolt slowly manually rotate the engines rotating assembly oil should exit all the push rods
if it does not you may have left out a oil gallery plug
If your engines hard to prime with oil pressure, measure the diameter of the tool and height of the lower two bands on the tool compared to your O.E.M. distributor , compare the two, a 12" caliper is almost a mandatory tool to own in this hobby

dcp2.jpg

verify the oil priming tool's spool distance, from the end of the tool compared too the OEM distributor
dialcalps.jpg


(look at this picture POSTED BELOW)
if your spool is incorrectly located,
theres sure to be a significant loss of potential pressurized oil.

PrimeTool800.JPG
 
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It can take 5-15 minutes priming with an electric drill to get oil up to all 16 rocker arms.
Very typical with hydraulic lifters.

Solid lifter cam oil will be at each rocker in 1-2 minutes priming.
 
An old Chevy distributor with the advance plate removed and distributor gear teeth ground off works best.

The factory cast iron distributors want to save for restorations. Some are rare and valuable.
 
use of an air ratchet saves considerable strain on an electric drill,
most electric drills rapidly heat up and some fail under the stress/resistance.
your better air ratchets remain un-phased
airratchetd.png


or you can go old school
and modify a brace to accept a manual connection to the oil primer tool....
been there done that regularly,
as it allows you to feel the oil pump build pressure

braceh.jpg


https://www.hotrod.com/articles/ccrp-0911-small-block-chevy-oil-pumps/

check yard sales, a good quality brace drill costs over $125 NEW,
but frequently costs under $20 at yard sales and flea markets.

mecbrace.jpg

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-901015?rrec=true
 
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I believe I see the problem
Oilpumptool2.JPG Oilpumptool1.JPG

That ain't gonna work............
S'posed to be for SBC and BBC ...ANOTHER Scorpion product I can't use....
 
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yeah, thats absolutely USELESS!:(:facepalm:
visit a local salvage yard for the basics youll need.
SBColprimer.jpg


BTW JUST SOME INFO, THE EARLY 265 SBC HAD OTHER ISSUES
When I got my 265 back from the machine shop the camshaft would not go all the way in. The machine shop installed a common 2 inch freeze plug instead of the correct 2 1/64” shallow rear cam plug. The back of the camshaft was hitting the freeze plug! The thrust surface on the cam sprocket is supposed to ride against the machined surface at the front of the block to correctly position the camshaft. I knocked out the incorrect freeze plug and test fit the camshaft with the sprocket installed. It’s a good thing I checked because I found that they had also installed the cam bearing almost ¼ inch too far back. The back oil hole in the cam bearing was completely blocked of by the camshaft. If I had installed the engine as the machine shop had built it there would have been zero oil supply to the lifters.

Just lining up the rear cam bearing holes to the block is not good enough on a 265. The bearing must also line up with the rear journal of the camshaft to ensure that both holes line up with the machined slot in the camshaft. The best way to check the position of the rear cam bearing is to test fit the bearing on the camshaft before you install it in the block. After you install the cam bearings, bolt the cam sprocket on the camshaft and test fit the camshaft into the block. The back edge of the camshaft should be flush with the back edge of the rear cam bearing. The point here is don’t trust the machine shop to correctly install the rear cam bearing in your 265. Have the machine shop leave the cam plug out so you can check the rear cam bearing position yourself.

cam-bearing-002.jpg


cam-bearing-009.jpg


cam-bearing-007.jpg


Cam_Bearings-021.jpg


After you are sure the rear cam bearing is installed correctly it’s time to install the rear cam plug. Do not use a 2 inch freeze plug! The 265 uses a rear cam plug which is slightly smaller in diameter than the cam plug used in a 1958 and up engines. 265 V8’s use a 2 1/64 inch shallow cam plug, while 1958 and up engines use a 2 3/32 inch cam plug. There is a machined step in the newer engines that prevent driving the plug to deep. There is no step machined into the block on a 55-57 engine, so care must be taken not to drive the plug to deep. The 1956 Shop Manual says the cam plug should be “installed flush to 1/32” deep to maintain a level surface on the rear of the cylinder block”. Here is my original cam plug and the correct replacement.

cam-bearing-012.jpg

All small block Chevy engines were produced with an annular groove under the rear cam bearing regardless of what year they are. This groove supplies oil to the two lifter galleries. The difference in the 55-56 engines is in how the oil is supplied to the groove. On 1955 and 1956 265’s full oil pressure from the main oil galley passed through a drilled passage to feed a small hole in the rear cam bearing. As the camshaft rotated the machined slot in the rear cam journal would uncover the hole allowing oil to flow (via the machined slot) out a second hole in the cam bearing that was located over the annular groove. This setup supplied "pulsed" oil to the annular groove which supplies reduced pressure to the lifter galleries.

Starting in 1957 the drilled passage from the main oil gallery was redesigned to connect directly to the annular groove. With this change the annular groove and the lifter galleries have full oil pressure. The rear cam bearing on 57 and up engines only needs one oil hole to lubricate the rear cam journal from high pressure oil in the annular groove, and there is no longer a need for the machined slot on the rear cam journal.

A popular modification on 55-56 265 blocks is to grind an oil passage in the block connecting the drilled oil feed passage to the annular groove. This way the 265’s will oil just like the other SBC’s, and there is no longer a need to use a camshaft with a machined slot. If you do this modification you should use a 1957 and up "window" distributor because the higher oil pressure in the lifter galleries may be too much for the 1955-56 distributor which may cause it to leak oil.

Here is a 265 and a newer 327 with the rear cam bearings removed. Note the different location of the drilled oil supply passage from the main oil gallery on these two engines.






If you convert the 265 to full pressure oiling you may have problems with your 55-56 distributor filling with oil. The lower bushing on these early distributors was fed low pressure "pulsed" oil from the RH lifter gallery. After the oil lubricates the lower distributor bushing it drains out via a hole above the bushing and then spills down the flat on the side of the distributor housing. That is what the "flat" on a 55-56 distributor is for, to let the oil from the distributor drain out. If you convert to full pressure oiling you could overcome the capacity of the drain hole, sending oil up the shaft, past the upper bushing, into the top of the distributor where it will cause all kinds of problems. A worn lower distributor bushing, combined with a high pressure-high volume oil pump, will make the problem worse. In 1957 Chevrolet redesigned the distributor to splash oiling from the drive gear so oil pressure in the lifter galley won’t have any affect on the distributor.


1957 and up distributors will work just fine in any 265. Even an HEI distributor will work in both stock and modified 265’s. If you are going to use the early 265 distributor you should not modify the block for full pressure oiling.









Steve

.
 
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Summit Racing, Jegs, Amazon people leave feedback. Worth reading.
I leave my own and here on Grumpys For everyone later.
 
You can modify your incorrect tool to make it work.
Do you have a buddy at a machine shop?
How about a technical school that has a machine shop?
You can either remove the current lower piece and cut it in the middle, remove as much as necessary on a lathe or bridgport (or even a belt sander will work) to match your distributor shaft, and tig weld the 2 pieces back together. Or just machine a new one from some aluminum round stock.
 
you might also try finding a large o-ring or two and put them on the upper edge of the spools center reduced diam area,
until the lower edge of the o-ring is preventing oil flow exiting the tool in use, or building up that area with J&B WELD EPOXY
and sanding it down to the correct location, and diameter,
if you temporarily wrap the lower void in tape then epoxy the area required,
then remove the tape after its solidified that may not be all that difficult to accomplish,
but as previously stated, simply visit a salvage yard,
and modifying a distributor body is a well proven route,

to having a functional tool in your tool chest.:D
visit a local salvage yard for the basics youll need.
SBColprimer.jpg

and yes the option to buy a good functional tool remains valid
 
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I contacted Scorpion Products (NOT the same as the rocker arm manufacturer) And discussed this problem.
WOULDN'T YA KNOW IT..... they sell these by the 1000's and have NEVER had a complaint!!

My guess is that people use these with intake manifolds on and cannot see how poorly these tools work.

Or, I'm just DIFFERENT !!
 
no, most people are TOTALLY CLUELESS and just can,t see
" how poorly the tool functions,"
"out of site out of mind"
Id bet 99% of the people have never even wondered,
why it took a great deal of time to get any oil pressure,
and most gave up trying, re-installed the distributor and fired up the cars engine,
never giving the useless tools failure too function a second thought!
Ive used several similar tools and I generally use a tool I fabricated from an old O.E.M. distributor, thats the first tool Ive seen like that one thats got a lower spool , thats basically useless.
most of the decent functional oil pump priming tools tools look like this
prime1.jpg

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/mel-pt13/overview/make/chevrolet

but keep in mind THOUSANDS OF THESE TOOLS (pictured below)
that are basically worthless ARE SOLD.,
yes it spins the oil pump, but it can never pressurize the blocks oil passages


prime2.jpg



https://www.summitracing.com/parts/...MI-N7Z_7XI4AIVChgMCh0lRQNjEAQYASABEgISgvD_BwE

I never tried the chevy oil pump primer tool in dual use situation,
(I never thought to try it) (priming a pontiac V8)(or a buick or caddy)
I simply fabricated one to use in the PONTIAC, BUICK, CADDY) engines, I built , the same way I did for CHEVYS,
in that I fabricated one using a used pontiac distributor,
I got dirt cheap from a local salvage yard as the basis for the priming tool

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/oil-pump-primer.6150/#post-19099
SBColprimer.jpg
SUM-850007_ml.jpg
primingtool.jpg


https://www.melling.com/videos/how-to-prime-engines-and-oil-pumps-by-melling/ melling sells a pump pressure tank for about $270

HF sells a pressure tank you could very easily use after minor conversion for $100


but there are much easier and cheaper routes
 
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I contacted Scorpion Products (NOT the same as the rocker arm manufacturer) And discussed this problem.
WOULDN'T YA KNOW IT..... they sell these by the 1000's and have NEVER had a complaint!!

My guess is that people use these with intake manifolds on and cannot see how poorly these tools work.

Or, I'm just DIFFERENT !!
Well, if there is any truth to that, then there 999 idiots out there and you are the 1 exception. Welcome to my world.:D
 
I requested a return for refund from Scorpion, citing the tool's defective design.
They have a 30 day return policy..I received on 1/18, and advised them of the problem on 2/18
January has 31 days.......................
They refused.
I have filed a claim with paypal.
We'll see how this shakes out............
 
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