Distributors won't seat on intake.

Drawmain

Drawmain

Well-Known Member
I'm in an interesting position, Grumpy maybe you can help out. My distributor will not settle on the pad on the intake. It engages the intermediate rod fine, but there is about a .20 gap left. I've been using shims set slightly larger than the measured gap to allow for the hold down tightness once timing is set. My question is this: I'm using a high volume pump. Are they slightly taller than standard pumps? If so, I'll go get a standard pump and swap them out so I won't need the shims. Thanks for any and all help/answers to this issue.

Oh, and I tried two distributors, so I know it's not the distributor.
 
The machining of aftermarket intakes in this area can vary. Other things that can change where the pad is located is if the heads have been machined (head and/or intake mounting surfaces) and the thickness of the gaskets used. Check the wear pattern on the distributor gear to make sure it is close to centered. If so, then use the shims, or 2 gaskets under the distributor. I don't think there is any difference in the oil pumps.
If you force the distributor down, you are forcing the driven gear inside the oil pump into the cover (not good). That clearance should be .002"
You might have to take a bit off the intermediate shaft to get all to sit correctly. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but that clearance should be .050"
 
Prussian Blue bought from Napa parrs stores can be used to check distributor gear to cam gear tooth patterns.
I don't feel switching to a stock volume oil pump is justified.
High volume has worked thus far.

Its best to install the oil pan & oil pump last while still on the engine stand.
Not always feesable or possible I know.
With the pan off you can check the Oil pump intermidiate shaft end clearances between the oil pump & distributor gear.
I just allow for some Jiggle room.
Never got Scientific measurement .
Maybe .020-.050".
 
With engine assembled the distributor should drop down fully onto the intake manifold with light hand pressure .
If not then need to investigate why not.
 
Chevy engines modified are prone to stack up tolerances.
Often aftermarket parts used.
 
We are mostly Chevrolet here but Ford engines with Hex oil pump driveshafts are often too long High po 4340 chrome moly steel.
I have had to cut trim 1/8-3/16" off.
Distributor seated fully then.

Olds V8 similar to Ford.
Ran into same problem once.
My old 403 Olds V8.
 
youll more than likely need to shorten the length of the oil pump drive shaft about .070 thousands and yeah, before you ask thats the over all length and deepening the mating slot both that amount and yeah, it only comes out by dropping the oil pan and temporarily removing the oil pump!
yeah you can CHEAT , they make spacers
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Shim-...gn=CSEGOOGLE&gclid=CI2n7ei5_s0CFQ6EaQod8-MBPg

https://www.summitracing.com/search?SortBy=BestKeywordMatch&SortOrder=Ascending&keyword=26150

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/msd-8495

WATCH THE VIDEO
COLLAR
http://www.autozone.com/ignition/di...table-all-slip-distributor-collar/139625_0_0/
ON MANY BIG BLOCK ENGINES
in many cases the stock distributor must be modified by machining off the existing locating collar and installing an adjustable sliding height locating ring
MOR-26217.jpg

msd-8539_w.jpg

https://www.msdperformance.com/products/distributors/chevrolet/parts/85561
https://chevroletperformanceparts.com/p/distributor-competition-adjustable-slip-collar-3


https://www.msdperformance.com/products/distributors/chevrolet/parts/8547

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/oil-pump-shaft.4966/#post-13781
http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/oil-pump-drive-shafts.123/#post-19025
morpumpdrive.jpg

milpumpdrive.jpg
 
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Brand: ARP

Manufacturer's Part Number: 134-7901

Part Type: Oil Pump Driveshafts

Product Line: ARP Oil Pump Driveshaft Kits

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UPC: 672036002138

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ARP has designed these extra heavy-duty shafts to provide you with the reliability you need. They are made from heat-treated chromoly steel, and are larger in diameter than the OEM unit. This enables the ARP shafts to handle the added torque requirements of increased oil pump capacity or heavy-viscosity lubricants. Rated at 220,000 psi, these ARP oil pump driveshafts are ready to do the job.

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I have used these ARP pump shafts in all my small block builds, and love them, but in this application it bit me. I have always installed them in 350,383 combos. But this time I am building a GM 400 block and did not know you have to either drill the block to 9/16” for the shaft to fit, but I already had an assembled short block by that time, ...read more

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ARP-134-7901
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My Speed Race shop Winners Circle in Joliet, IL stocks ARP Oil Pump intermediate driveshafts Marc.
I have used them for years. Never had an issue.
 
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These oil pump driveshafts are CNC-machined from 4130 chromoly and are centerless-ground to avoid stress risers. These race-proven shafts eclipse breakage-prone stock units that frequently fail when used with high-volume oil systems, heavy racing oil, or high-rpm applications. The ends are induction heat-treated to reduce wear.

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Okay, I'll get an ARP intermediate shaft, drop the pan and pull out the pump. Before I reinstall the pan I'll test the length, probably hold them side by side too. If they are the same length, I'll trim one down, but .20 is a big trim.

I noticed a lot of different lengths in Grumpy's post. It could be possible I got the wrong size shaft initially. I didn't realize there were so many. I also may have ordered a BBC pump, they are 5 bolt instead of 4 bolt, correct? Maybe I'll pull the pan and then see what I have in there before I order. I'll get back to you on that.

I see moroso offers a bbc pump used in sbc shaft that is 5.625 instead of 5.75. That's a difference of .125, about half of what I'm seeing. Tolerance stacking is a definite possibility.
 
Drawmain said:
Okay, I'll get an ARP intermediate shaft, drop the pan and pull out the pump. Before I reinstall the pan I'll test the length, probably hold them side by side too. If they are the same length, I'll trim one down, but .20 is a big trim.


Quick question, would a BBC intermediate shaft be longer? It's possible I got the wrong part during the build.
Click to expand...
Grumpy would know.
I have never used a BBC oil pump .on a SBC.

I would leave the distributor installed with or without shims you want.
With the oil pan off check actual oil pump intermediate up & down vertical play- clearances with the oil pump installed Marc.
Install the oil pan last.
Should be easier at your Bud's shop with his car lift to get the job done.

Corvettes can be Nose Heavy....
A heavy duty steady rest up front will stabilize to work underneath safe on a 2-post car lift.

All corvettes are short wheelbase cars.
Lift arms are hard to set ideal at times with different brand lifts.
 
Back to the gap size. When we originally put the motor together that .20 gap amazed us, we thought we were not on the slot of the shaft, but we found out we were after a few test fits. I was still using the original distributor back then. My buddy had a spare HEI that he'd just swapped out and we got the same result. At the time we assumed it was the intake out of spec and just shimmed the pad of the intake to about .23 to allow for gears to mesh properly, which they do. I know its engaged cause I get 70 psi cold idle and 50 psi hot on the gauge so it's spinning the pump . So here is the million dollar question. Since the distributor is engaging the pump, and the gears are meshing, was my initial observation correct? If I shorten the shaft, will that screw up the gears on the distributor and the cam?
 
Drawmain said:
Back to the gap size. When we originally put the motor together that .20 gap amazed us, we thought we were not on the slot of the shaft, but we found out we were after a few test fits. I was still using the original distributor back then. My buddy had a spare HEI that he'd just swapped out and we got the same result. At the time we assumed it was the intake out of spec and just shimmed the pad of the intake to about .23 to allow for gears to mesh properly, which they do. I know its engaged cause I get 70 psi cold idle and 50 psi hot on the gauge so it's spinning the pump . So here is the million dollar question. Since the distributor is engaging the pump, and the gears are meshing, was my initial observation correct? If I shorten the shaft, will that screw up the gears on the distributor and the cam?
Click to expand...

The 5- bolt end cover oil pump is a Big Block Chevy oil pump.
Small block Chevy is a 4-bolt oil pump.

Looking around Grumpy s site using search function.
Haven't used right key words yet to find.

Another option would be to use an adjustable slip collar distributor.
Or make it on a Metal Lathe.
Many Vertex OAC Mags are set up like that intentional with an adjustable slip collar for all SBC, BBC, & Tall Decks.

HEI GM distributor is rough cast aluminum, have to look at a spare in my basement to see if it could be done easily.

Obtaining right oil pump driveshaft to fit is best option likely.
 
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Moroso Heavy-Duty Oil Pump Intermediate Shafts

Part Type: Oil Pump Driveshafts
Application: Find out if this fits your application

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Brand: Moroso

Manufacturer's Part Number: 22090

Part Type: Oil Pump Driveshafts

Product Line: Moroso Heavy-Duty Oil Pump Intermediate Shafts

Summit Racing Part Number: MOR-22090

UPC: 084663220906

For Use with High Volume Oil Pump: Yes

Hardened Shaft: Yes

Sleeve Included: No

Drive Gear Included: No

Quantity: Sold individually.

Notes: 0.125 in. shorter than stock. For use when a big block Chevy pump is used in a small block Chevy.

In-Store Pickup: Choose In-store pick-up (OH, GA, NV) on our web site.

Moroso Performance Products manufactures a complete line of heavy-duty oil pump intermediate shafts. These shafts are made of high-quality steel for extended reliability. The steel sleeve is pinned to maintain correct alignment between the oil pump and the shaft.

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Manufacturer's Part Number: 26217

Part Type: Distributor Hold-Down Clamps

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Fastener Style: Bolt

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Notes: Adjustable slip collar design.

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These Moroso adjustable distributor slip collars can be positioned on a distributor to adjust installed height for dead center gear alignment. They are made of machined steel and bolt together using flush mount allen head bolts. The slip collars also the distributor's lubrication grooves to line up correctly with the existing oil passages in the engine block.

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Reviewer: NICHOLAS from OR

Date: April 19, 2015

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Holds distributor very well, had no problem installing
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