MSD ignition system

[hornet350]

Hi Guys,

Firstly great forum!

I need some advise please, I dont know what to do with my ignition system, there are two parts im considering but with your help im sure i would be able to make my choice.

i want to use the msd probillet 85551 and a 6al 6452 ignition box with the blaster 2 coil,,, but many say that if im using the 6al i should just use the street fire heiwith a built in coil or a Delco setup and hook it up with the 6AL it should be the same thing and would save me cash. Is this right?

 

[grumpyvette]

NO! IN MY OPINION, they are not correct, While either ignition system will function just fine up to 5500rpm-6000rpm, and I have gotten both systems to work well in the past, the MSD billet distributor and BLASTER COIL with the 6AL 2425 in my experience has a more consistent spark at over 5500 rpm and the blaster coils tend to put out a bit stronger spark, but I would suggest asking MSD tech support for advice on matching the components, and distributor gear to cam gear compatibility .
the coil in cap HEI tends too over heat in some applications, the stand alone coil and billet distributor is easier to trouble shoot in my experience and less prone to heat related issues. BTW if you can find a place like "the upper front pass side foot well under the dash" to mount the 6al control where it won,t get overly hot or wet it tends to function better and be less likely to crap out from heat and moisture

http://www.msdignition.com/Products/Ign ... ntrol.aspx

http://www.msdignition.com/Products/Dis ... butor.aspx

http://www.msdignition.com/products/coils/

Toll Free MSD Tech Line: 888-673-7859

MSD Tech Line: 915-855-7123

Call our tech line Monday through Friday, 7am to 5pm Mountain Standard Time

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[Indycars]

Welcome to the forum!

What's all this nice equipment going in?

 

[DorianL]

Welcome to the forum

MSD 6452... I could not find that PN back. Are you sure that's the right number?

 

[hornet350]

Thanks Grumpy

Thank you for the advice i think im gonna stick to the full MSD setup, had a chat with the guys at MSD the Pro Billet and 6425 with the blaster 2 coil is a good match. so that's my route.. I just had to get it from you guys after reading this forum.

These are the specs of the motor Indycar, if possible could you guys please let me know if i should change or not use anything :mrgreen:

Chevy 350 with a 30 thou bore
crower 00422 cam
Holley DP 700 carb
Edelbrock performer intake
MSD setup mentioned
1.6 full roller rockers
202/1.6 valves

I don't know what springs to buy for that cam please help

Sorry DorainL it was a typo... It was supposed to be MSD 6425....

Thanks again Guys!

 

[mathd]

First, welcome to the forum

Thats a great ignition, will not regret it. Just try not to set the 6al box close to the exhaust manifold as it dont like excessive heat.
Thats the exact same ignition i got, had zero problem with it so far.

That sound like an interesting build, usually you can get the valve spring spec on the cam card, i see your using 1.6 rocker so i guess it will be better calling them.
Also with 1.6 rocker you will be at about .600 lift thats sound alot, id double check to make sure all clearance are correct. You did not say what head you will be using, if your using GM heads am pretty sure it wont fit(they usually dont work/need over 470-500 lift).

Any more detail about the build is welcome, am curious

 

[Indycars]

Thought the cam specs might help others reading this thread.

We need to know a lot more about your setup, such as:

- Transmission and Stall Speed if Automatic
- Rear Gear Ratio
- Intended Use (Street Only, Street/Strip, Race Only, Daily driver)
- Car Weight
- Cylinder Heads, Chamber Size and Flow Numbers If Possible
- Rotating Assembly - Is it Cast or Forged?
- Are you using pump gasoline, what octane?
- Does this car have to meet emission standards?

Valve Lift with 1.6 rocker ratio is .582/.602, but you will have to
subtract the lifter clearance of .026/.028 to get the actual lift.



Intake Valve Closing Angle will be 62°

 

[hornet350]

Yho! Thanks Guys,

Ok here is the deal with the heads i have a choice of two one is a Dart Pro 1:

•Dart Aluminum Cylinder Heads
•200 cc Intake Runner
•64 cc Combustion Chamber
•Angle Plug
•2.02 Intake Valve; Stainless Steel
•1.60 Exhaust Valves; Stainless Steel
•.600 Lift Valve Springs; 135 Seat Pressure
•CromMoly Retainers
•7* Machined Locks
•7/16 Screw in Studs
•Flat Guide Plates
•Heads are set up for Hydraulic Roller or Solid Flat Tappet Cam set up

The other is a brodix which im still trying to find the specs for the numbers on the side of the head are AD 298 STR 0635 and at the front are AD298
I know im being a nag but does any! have a part number or name and model of spring i can use.?

Tranny : turbo 350 auto with a trans pack and a 3000 stall

all this is going into an 1973 AMC hornet rambler ( like the one 007 flipped) and it has the original 4100 diff.

Intended use is street/stripe but when i put it down i want to sh!t myself
the car does not have to meet any emission standards and will be using pump gas

You guys advise is excellent please let me know more
:ugeek:

 

[Indycars]

If you go the Brodix website and enter AD298, it will tell you: http://www.brodix.com/faq/faq.php

Your part was cast on: 9/14/87
The serial number is: AD298
Your part is: STREET

So that's a really old head and they don't give you any details, you would have to call Brodix (479-394-1075) to find out.

The car is going to weigh about 3400 lbs with the car & driver.
http://www.automobile-catalog.com/make/ ... /1973.html

I did a calculation on your dynamic compression ratio and assuming a 64cc chamber, flat top piston with 5cc valve reliefs, quench height of .040 the DCR would be 8.45:1. You might possibly have detonation problems, depending on your gasoline's octane in your area (all I can get is 91) etc etc. If you retard the cam timing to lower the DCR, it's going to be even less streetable.

Grumpy will know better, but it looks like to me the Crower 00422 camshaft is too big for your application. You are also going to be on the verge of needing a forged rotating assembly. The mean piston speed is going to be approaching 4000 Feet per Minute (FPM) at 6800 RPM.

So the question is what is your budget for this engine ???




I'm not familiar with that rear end, have to wonder if it's really strong enough for this engine. Also we need to know the gear ratio, cause you are going to need something in 3.5 to 4.0 range.

Sorry but at this point, it won't do any good to spec a valve spring until the camshaft has been decided on. It would be helpful to slow down a bit, and back up to consider the BIG PICTURE .....

- Budget
- Possibly Replace Rear End With Stronger One
- Possibly a Cam With Less Duration & Lift
- Which Cylinder Head For Sure
- What Piston and Rotating Assembly
- Cooling System Big Enough (This engine will be putting a much larger load on the radiator)

It all has to work together as a system !

 

[grumpyvette]

Yho! Thanks Guys,

Ok here is the deal with the heads i have a choice of two one is a Dart Pro 1:

•Dart Aluminum Cylinder Heads
•200 cc Intake Runner
•64 cc Combustion Chamber
•Angle Plug
•2.02 Intake Valve; Stainless Steel
•1.60 Exhaust Valves; Stainless Steel
•.600 Lift Valve Springs; 135 Seat Pressure
•CromMoly Retainers
•7* Machined Locks
•7/16 Screw in Studs
•Flat Guide Plates
•Heads are set up for Hydraulic Roller or Solid Flat Tappet Cam set up

The other is a brodix which im still trying to find the specs for the numbers on the side of the head are AD 298 STR 0635 and at the front are AD298
I know im being a nag but does any! have a part number or name and model of spring i can use.?

Tranny : turbo 350 auto with a trans pack and a 3000 stall

all this is going into an 1973 AMC hornet rambler ( like the one 007 flipped) and it has the original 4100 diff.

Intended use is street/stripe but when i put it down i want to sh!t myself
the car does not have to meet any emission standards and will be using pump gas

You guys advise is excellent please let me know more
:ugeek:

do you know what compression your engine will have and its rear gear ratio?

I helped a friend install a 383 SBC, with a muncie 4 speed in a 1968 AMX back in about 1977 and we used this cam.
http://www.cranecams.com/product/cart.p ... il&p=23968
and a 4.11 rear gear ratio

 

[hornet350]

ok im a bit new in the v8 game

I will get the requested info However i will be using the crower 00422 cam and the dart heads, from what i deduced that spring mentioned on the spec list (on my earlier post) should be fine for the cam (600 lift) am i right?

Im using all the standard parts at the bottom end just included ARP Rod bolts, high volume oil pump and a double roller edlbrock timing chain.
The will be running on 95 octane fuel.

 

[Indycars]

Per the data sheet on your Dart Pro 1 heads the Comp Cams 987 spring is good to .620 inch lift.

I'm using the same spring on my Brodix IK200, but when I check my spring clearances I had a minimum coil bind clearance of .083 inches. If I had an additional lift of .040 inches (.600) it would likely have problems. But that's what they sell on your Pro1 heads. You will want to measure carefully and make sure you have needed coil bind clearance for the spring of .060 inches minimum.

At Summit they are $90.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-987-16

It wouldn't hurt to call these people and see what they recommend.
http://www.racingsprings.com/



Below are my clearances with the 987 CompCam springs.



Read thru this thread, there is more than just checking the the bind clearance.
viewtopic.php?f=52&t=181&hilit=valve+spring+clearance

Sounds like you have already purchased the Crower 00422 camshaft. Are you going to use their lifters ???

 

[hornet350]

Im checking on those springs now, actually i was looking at the comp cams rockers they look like a good option.
Was worried about this spring there was much more to it than just finding a dual spring and installing it....LOL

Thanks will keep you posted