The mysterious X-1. How do you set this up?

Black Magik

Member
I hope that I can articulate this... so I have hopes for a well thought out and coordinated engine build. I picked up an X-1 years ago and have yet to do much with it. I just didn't have the knowledge base to execute it properly. I'm looking for some help with that.

The idea is to put a small block chevy into a Nash Metropolitan, lift it with a straight axle in the Gasser style, and top it with the 6 2bbl intake. I would like to maximize the performance that this intake will offer.

With that being said, I will be forming the project around it. The only constraints will be a 4 spd and a (best guess) 2100 lb Metropolitan. I'm not sure what configuration would make this successful? I haven't seen much on the dual plenum log ram intakes. I'm assuming that it would be similar to the tunnel ram with a divided plenum for tuning/builds.
 

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As it just occurred to me, not everyone would have this intake on their shelf... I called Edelbrock "techs". Wow... all I can say is wow! They refused to give me plenum volume, runner length etc... "Proprietary Information". They either didn't want my business, or they didn't know. So I went to the shelf and measured the best I could with my decimal/metric tape measure. Probably good that I did... apparently their reproduction that is "exact" is a 3 bolt 2bbl, and mine is a 4 bolt 2bbl intake.
20151001_125533.jpg 20151001_125843.jpg
Carb openings 1.45"X 2.96"
Deck height 5.90"
Intake ports 1.20"X 1.94"
Runner length 8.50" manifold flange to the inside of plenum (remarkably straight!)
Plenum volume approx. 101.38 cu in. per side.

Plenum inside measurements are 13.7"L 3.7"W 2.0"D
 
your "problem" is not going to really require much more than carefully rebuilding the carbs then correctly adjusting the throttle linkage

Ive worked on several similar systems in the past and most people are clueless, its just not that difficult if you understand what your trying to accomplish, your trying to get a totally predictable and repeatable aior flow entering each plenum, this may be rather time consuming but its not difficult if taken in stages and done in a logical manor.
most three duce set-ups have a center carb that has an idle circuit and two outer carbs that don,t that act only like the secondary throttle bodys in a four barrel carb, this is not the case with 6 x 2 barrel cab set-ups, all six carbs will be nearly identical, and all 6 contribute to air flow and idle, this mandates you must have consistency, you can,t adjust a single carb randomly or your get more problems than you can imagine, done correctly you get a smooth powerful transition.
youll need two vacuum gauges, hook one to each plenum and use to adjust each single center carb to flow at an equal vacuum and read the plugs to verify the fuel/air ratio is close to correct.
remember youll want fairly light spring return spring tension on all six individual carbs in the event of a linkage failure or breakage to help reduce the potential for a wide open throttle run-away condition should the linkage break, but you don,t want the combined spring tension to offer resistance thats going to make easy throttle petal depression noticeable

mor-64917.jpg


vgauge.gif

http://www.harborfreight.com/fuel-pump-and-vacuum-tester-93547.html
and a fuel pressure gauge.
125843aa.jpg

youll want too have four temporary carburetor block off plates , that you can use to test with ,these should be about 3/8" thick aluminum,
so they are not easily bent or distorted when clamped in place on the four outer carb mount locations,

(the front and rear locations on each plenum, )
almost any machine shop can make a set of four block-off plates if you give them a gasket rather in-expensively

blockpl.jpg


25533a.jpg

the intake basically has two similar plenums ,
P pass side plenum feeds the drivers side or odd numbered cylinder head ports
D drivers side plenum feeds the pass or even numbered side cylinder head ports


btw a yard stick, 15-20 ft of clear plastic tube , SOME FOOD DYE,
and a drill, a 3 foot section of 1x 4 wood ,ty-wraps are all thats required to build a manometer


look at link

READ THRU THE LINKED INFO ABOVE
you can easily fabricate a custom built MANOMETER (fancy word for a tool that allows you to balance and equalize the flow rates of the two throttle bodys on the cross fire intake manifold

STEP ONE



Shopping



Hit the local hardware store and buy 12 feet or so of 5/16” or 3/8” clear vinyl tubing. There are some photos circulating the web of a home made manometer using very thin tubing . like maybe 1/8”. If you are considering this, slap yourself or poke yourself in the eye with a sharp stick . . because that will be less painful that trying to get the bubbles out of 1/8” tubing.



Get some nylon clips to hold the tubing . . . if you are an actual genuine red-neck, you may use strips of duct tape or bent over rusty nails. For a classy read-neck manometer, splurge and get a get a $1 yardstick. Here again black marks every inch is all you really need, but the yardstick is in the budget, so go ahead, get crazy.

You need two one inch long pieces of vacuum hose . . you can buy new or snip some from your vacuum gage or from under your hood somewhere.

Some food coloring is nice, but not required. BTW, the term ‘food’ actually means “food, clothing, hands, garage floor, car body, dog and anything else nearby” coloring.

Now the tricky part is finding special ‘manometer wood’. This is rare stuff not usually available at any store. Fortunately it can often be found propped up in the corner of the average garage, origin unknown, age unknown. It comes in various sizes and is easily recognized by the brown color.

Shopping expedition should yield a bootay pile similar to this:

mano1.jpg

STEP TWO



Build the manometer. (i.e. arrange the bootay like so:)

mano2.jpg

STEP THREE



Stick the vacuum tubing into the ends of the vinyl

mano3.jpg



Hardly deserves its own step . . . OK, we’ll do the hanger too:



In keeping with the overall red-neck theme .. concoct some form of hanger. Here we see the recycled peg board hanger method.
mano4.jpg


OPTIONAL STEP



Your water manometer is exactly as accurate as anything you can buy. It is also very . . . responsive, shall we say. If you hook your manometer up to the port when it is pulling a lot of vacuum, you have .001 seconds to disconnect it before the water goes bye-bye. Don’t worry about it if it happens, It will not hurt the engine at all.



You can install restrictors in the line to dampen the response of the manometer without changing the accuracy. Any small orifice will do and it actually only has to be in one leg. I used a piece of aluminum rod with a 1/16” hole drilled thru it. I later discovered that a very small plastic wall anchor stuck into one of the pieces of vacuum tubing works almost as well.

mano5.jpg

And Viola! (that’s French for Gosh Dern!) You now have a working manometer!




STEP FOUR



Just add water.



You can mix up some food coloring in a bowl . . dip one end ogf the manometer tube in the water and suck on the other end until you get about half the manometer’s height in water sucked in. Remove the end from the bowl and hold both ends up high and the manometer will fill up nicely . . .



Perform a quality control test of the hanger mechanism:
mano6.jpg

(the picture above is a cross fire intake,)

25533a.jpg

When your tuning a 6x2 barrel carb intake you use block off plates on the 4 outer carb locations to start as you'll need to verify correct function of each of the carbs individually first as a badly adjusted carb can make your ability to tune miserable, thus each of the two bank, separate plenums (D and P pictured above) is adjusted and balanced with the two outer locations on each seperate plenum blocked off, with block off plates.
consistency and repeat-ability is key, you'll want all the float levels and carb jets set identically to start
you then adjust the two center carbs, (theres only one on each plenum, at this point) to be as close to equal and balanced as you can get, first with two vacuum gauges , too get the correct adjustment close to correct, then once your close you balance the vacuum with the two plenums connected too the vacuum gauges, first, then fine tune with the manometer.
but once you balance the two plenums with Your water manometer , take notes on the idle adjustment screw,setting float levels and throttle blade locations, I generally try to get the engine to idle at the lowest rpm that will result in a reasonably steady vacuum gauge reading.
once thats done you put those two carbs back on the work bench and tag them with linen tags as correctly adjusted, and then you repeat the whole process with two more, carbs ,and get them set up as close to identical as you can too the first two, once those two are correctly set up using the center location on each plenum only, you repeat the process with the last two carbs on the center location on each plenum.
only once you have all three sets of two carbs correctly adjusted and balanced with the manometer do you install all three carbs on each plenum.
at this point youll generally find that with three carbs on each bank the engine idles at 1600rpm-1700rpm. due to all three carbs idle circuits allowing air flow into the plenum on each bank,so the 4 corner end carbs throttle blade adjustment is now each equally adjusted to a slightly more closed position, as you want the center carb on each bank to be supplying about 70% of the total air flow and each end carb about 15%, (you don,t touch the center carb on each bank)
now for the throttle linkage, the center two carbs will act as primaries,
youll set up a progressive linkage
where only the two center carbs throttle blades open until the engine reaches about 3000rpm,, this requires the linkage to have slide stops on the end carb's linkage, but a firm mechanical link on the two center carb throttle shafts.
on a slowly opened throttle, at that point, in the gas petal depression, you want the 4 outer carbs (front and rear pass and front and rear drivers side carbs to start opening equally) usually at about 1/4 throttle ,and by the time the gas petals completely depressed to the floor all six carbs should be fully open


http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/custom-throttle-linkage.861/#post-33717


http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/mc/carburetors/94-series.shtml
1031.jpg


Edelbrock_ X1_2150_wCarbs.jpg
takes a bit of experience
setting up the carb linkage correctly
chevy6d1.jpg
 
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When coordinating parts on an engine build, would you treat it like a tunnel ram? I'm not sure what I should model it after, with the two separate plenum.

Additionally, with sizing/jetting of multiple carbs per bank, would the diminished vacuum require more cfm than what the "carb calculators" say? I believe I read on one of the links here that 2 4 bbls on a common plenum would flow at a slightly reduced rate than advertised due to the deminished vacuum with the additional venturi of a second carb. My current linkage is straight "drag" linkage, so I'll open all 6 at the same rate.
 
if you have a strait drag linkage, opening all six 2 barrel carbs at the same time, its been my experience that youll find its going to be very difficult to drive under part throttle,it will either bog or stutter or want to jump too wot, it will tend to want to jump from idle to a run away, race too much higher rpms with little fine rpm control mandated by your foot on the throttle.
I helped tune a guys 6x2 caddy engine awhile back and this was the case.
you don,t need to pay exorbitant prices for linkage, shop carefully

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/custom-throttle-linkage.861/#post-33717

btw

before you get crazy chasing some problem your sure is an intermittent fuel delivery issue
(1) Do a compression test!
(2) verify your ignition advance curve, and verify the ignition systems working correctly , the spark plugs are new, properly gaped and the ignition wires in excellent condition visually and with an OHMS meter.
(3) adjust your valves, correctly
(4) carefully verify theres no vacuum leaks, in lines or gaskets
(5)Check the fuel delivery system, WITH A GAUGE, while the engines under real operational inertial loads to verify you have a consistent 5-6 psi at the carburetor inlet port
(6) change out the fuel and air filters, especially if over 3-4 months old
(7) actually check your exhaust back-pressure levels
(8) verify your return style fuel pressure regulator and fuel lines function as intended
(9)verify your using FRESH FUEL WITHOUT MOISTURE OR PARTICULAR CONTAMINANTS
(10) actually look for and read installation instructions and rated flow and pressure limitations on fuel pumps and filters
(11) If ALL of the above are normal, only then start looking at the carburetor, and tuning issues

I think most guys would be amazed at how often, a high flow water separating fuel filter installed near the fuel tank that,s being checked and drained, with the filter medium changed regularly will cure or prevent a good many TUNING ISSUES
http://www.harborfreight.com/38-x-38-ba ... 68213.html
38fit1.jpg


38fit2a.jpg


38fit3.jpg


http://www.amazon.com/RACOR-320R-RAC-01 ... m_sbs_sg_2

http://www.amazon.com/Moeller-Separatin ... d_sbs_sg_1
fuelsep2.jpg


fuel injection usually requires a 40psi plus fuel pressure, the line size and the fuel pressure regulator will have a big effect on your results, theres some threads and calculators above that will help,
generally a 110-150 gph pump and 3/8" / AN#6 lines minimum ,works fine up to about 550- maybe even 575hp, IN A FEW CASES with carbs BUT above that POWER LEVEL Id suggest a 1/2 AN#8 line

 
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In for a penny, in for a pound. I'll check into some different linkage. The current setup is running Heim rod ends at all joints.

Ball joint rod ends seem to be the way to go with the chances of binding on that many "links in the chain". I see some of these angles and cringe.
9261-bb-2-1.png
 
Ha ha ha... sorry. I need to learn patience. I keep looking back to read more, and I end up posting questions that you answer in your responses once they're complete. In my own defense, the forum seems to show your responses in real time while you're posting. I'm just really excited about learning more and doing this project right. ☺
 
yeah theses some minor software glitch, I can post info and it shows up in the thread nearly instantly much of the time but if I go back a couple minutes later and add a sentence or correct spelling mistakes or add a picture it occasionally shows its added and posted, yet I go back an hour later and that additional infos still in lala land, yet if I start to re-enter it I find the original missing info , previously posted, has popped up????
its not all the time but its enough to be annoying, and I don,t doubt I'm causing it occasionally by doing something wrong.
(computers, old geezers, software and I and my two finger typing style don,t always mesh well) and yes if I read through a post and realize I forgot vital info, or its not clearly explained I will go back and try to correct the flaw or lack of info.
many times I think , to myself..this guy must know what I meant,
or obviously youll need to do X before proceeding to Y,
but then I think back to when I was 18, ...
and I go back and add clairification, because no mater how clear I think what I posted might be, I still ocasionally get guys asking me why I never mentioned a step I thought was totally obvious
 
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yeah theses some minor software glitch, I can post info and it shows up in the thread nearly instantly much of the time but if I go back a couple minutes later and add a sentence or correct spelling mistakes or add a picture it occasionally shows its added and posted, yet I go back an hour later and that additional infos still in lala land, yet if I start to re-enter it I find the original missing info , previously posted, has popped up????
its not all the time but its enough to be annoying, and I don,t doubt I'm causing it occasionally by doing something wrong.
(computers, old geezers, software and I and my two finger typing style don,t always mesh well) and yes if I read through a post and realize I forgot vital info, or its not clearly explained I will go back and try to correct the flaw or lack of info.
many times I think , to myself..this guy must know what I meant,
or obviously youll need to do X before proceeding to Y,
but then I think back to when I was 18, ...
and I go back and add clairification, because no mater how clear I think what I posted might be, I still ocasionally get guys asking me why I never mentioned a step I thought was totally obvious

Kinda like leading a horse to water-- but can't make him drink. Most on here have car experience-- but some you have to hold their hand to go through all the steps to get what they ask for.
 
So when planning an engine around this manifold, would you treat it like a tunnel ram, when working the math for parts selection? I have nothing selected other than this manifold.
 
No, it,s not an intake designed too mostly maximize top rpm torque/horse power,in the 5000rpm-7500 rpm plus range,
at the expense of a bit less concern for the rest of the rpm range like a tunnel ram.

too look correct in any car remember,that intake design was popular in the hot rodded cars built from 1935-1955 time frame,cars most guys RE-built those earlier cars as they got cheap enough, to make it economical to do so in the late 1955-1965 time span, as hot rods, when the chevy small block was most popular, and multi carb intakes were the hot ticket
yes you can stick that intake and engine in the Nash metropolitan, and it will look like it belongs in that time frame IF you can restore the Nash body and frame to decent condition

nashp1.jpg

nashp2.jpg

nashp3.jpg

nashp4.jpg

youll first need to decide the car your likely to install it in, because,youll need to match components to the application.
the heads, you select and the engines displacement,
,the cam timing and engine compression , the transmission, and rear gear ratios
and headers are all going to need to match the application,
and that would all be rather different if the cars lets say a 2200 lb cobra replica, or if you can rebuild the Nash, to decent condition, vs a 4500 lb 4x4 truck, or a 4300 lb 1970 caddy 4 door,where it would look totally out of place.
that intakes going to work best in a fairly light car , and one geared to use the 3000rpm-5800rpm power band where that cross ram intakes designed to work rather well, this power range is about ideal for a hydraulic roller cam,and automatic transmission car with an over drive trans. and while a well designed over drive automatic transmission is a valid option,
a manual 5 speed with an over drive top gear would be ideal
the intake design would work well on something similar to Ricks T-bucket engine
but with minor changes, Id be looking to build a fairly high compression 383-427 sbc
in as light weight of a car as you can find and as its a rather nostalgic intake design.
Id be looking to match its look to a car built in the 1935-55 time frame with a 5 speed manual or OD auto trans and a fairly high rear gear that would maximize that intakes mid rpm torque potential, I'm assuming your going to want to drive it on the street without problems so I personally would not want a convertible but rather something that could be driven in the rain and locked up.
examples
1932_ford_016.jpg


2eyh06p.jpg

21690buick.jpg

1940-ford.jpg

35pontiac.jpg

Pontiac_Economy.jpg

1935_ford_pickup_truck.jpg


http://autoweldchassis.com/metrop.ivnu

http://www.instructables.com/id/How-I-built-my-own-frame-and-installed-a-mustang-1/

http://www.hotrod.com/cars/featured/hrdp-1012-1954-nash-metropolitan/

http://www.hotrod.com/news/1111sr-1961-nash-metropolitan/

http://www.americanrestomods.com/1959-nash-metropolitan-restomod/

http://www.allpar.com/cars/adopted/nash-metropolitan.html

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/tbucket-engine-project-dart-shp.3814/

WHATS YOUR THOUGHTS HERE!
 
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Its such a small car.
Very short wheelbase.
I don't know how it would handle above 100 mph.
Neat project . INSANITY .
 
It's definitely going in the metropolitan. With the added weight of a chassis (2x3 .120 wall) I figure that I'll be at 2300 lbs. I roughed out the frame to about 43' of steel under it.

I'm fairly sold on a 4 speed due to space constraints, and my love of banging gears. I was looking at a Jerico wide ratio, possibly with a V-Gate. Unless I can find a 5 spd one similar in size.

I haven't decided on gears. 25" tires will be about the largest I can see under the fender skirts.

I have my eye on an Iron Eagle block for the build. Since it's not a super high rpm manifold (as I initially thought), I am going to look into the 427. Tall decks with raised large journal cam, demands a closer look.

It's going to be more of a track car with limited street use. And 87Vette, I'm expecting it to handle horrible with the addition of a solid front axle, 44" track and a high CG. Definitely not a practical car.
 
I've been reading and reading on intake and head flow/choke point/intake runner harmonics. The intake runner harmonics has kind of got me stumped. What exactly am I reading when I see the results on this calculator? Would I be looking at peak VE, or possibly peak torque/ horsepower ranges to match the cam with?

Either way youll find that youll want a port size in the 2.4sq -“2.9 sq inch area
Now use this calculator to figure ideal port length, REMEMBER youll need to add the 6 in the cylinder head to the intake runner length to get the total length and you can,t exceed the engines REDLINE RPM which with hydrolic lifters seldom is higher than 6400rpm
http://www.bgsoflex.com/intakeln.html
I added 6 to my intake's 8.5" runners. Since the calculator works in whole numbers, I rounded up and down for two inputs 14 and 15. Then averaged... the 4 and 7% are a little confusing.
 
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http://www.bgsoflex.com/intakeln.html

the LENGTH of the port will partly determine the ram tun harmonics your 15" runner length falls here
  • For 3rd harmonic, RPM range is from 5885 to 6725 with a pulse strength of 7 percent
  • For 4th harmonic, RPM range is from 4588 to 5131 with a pulse strength of 4 percent
this is almost ideal for a SBC

remember your cylinder head port cross sectional area, valve timing, (lift, duration, and LCA),
your compression ratio, displacement, and header design also help set the useful rpm band

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/calculating-header-design.185/

you might find these threads below useful

example if you built a 383-406 sbc and selected heads with intake ports with about a 3 sq inch cross section ans a cam with about a 240-245 intake duration at .050 lift,with about a .530-.550 lift, it would all be closely matched , to operate in that 4500rpm-6400 rpm band, then youll need to select a matching drive train

I think youll want a power band in the 3000-6300 rpm range so a 25" tire diam. and a 3000rpm stall converter matched to a 4.11:1 rear gear with an OD trans like a 200r4 makes sense

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...earing-and-trans-choice-made-correctly.11697/

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...hing-the-drive-train-to-the-engine-combo.741/

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/tbucket-engine-project-dart-shp.3814/

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/tips-on-building-a-383-sbc-stroker.428/

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/bits-of-383-info.38/

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/350-383-rebuild.11115/

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/matching-parts-and-a-logical-plan.7722/

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/what-to-look-for-in-a-good-engine-combo.9930/

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...ting-started-in-the-car-hobby.339/#post-52497

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-calculators-and-basic-math.10705/#post-46737




CALCULATORS
http://www.wallaceracing.com/calcafhp.php

http://www.wallaceracing.com/calchpaf.php

http://www.rbracing-rsr.com/runnertorquecalc.html

http://horsepowercalculators.net/intake ... old-design
 
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The best thing you can do is add a few hundred pounds of Ballast weight intentional.
Make them from Lead wheel weights.

Also get the bump steer correct.
 
Additionally, the larger flow 23° heads using a 60/40 valve offset vs std. Is there a real drawback to utilizing the 60/40 other than cost of the specialized rocker arms? Do they make the valve train any more or less stable/stronger/weaker? I figured it was a necessity because they stuffed bigger valves in there and had to make some changes. I am skeptical of the effects this has; they always fail to mention any real downside to their "miracle improvements". I don't see any articles mentioning a design benefit/pitfall.
 
theres no reason to go to the 60/40 style heads your not going to be able to use the marginal potential extra air flow at the rpm range they are designed to provide an advantage at with that intake, it would be throwing away a couple thousand dollars in money spent on expensive off set rockers and in some cases off set lifters for little if any gain.you can easily build a 500plus horse power engine with the standard
BRODIX,
AIR FLOW RESEARCH,
DART,
TRICK FLOW
or similar 23 degree cylinder heads

http://www.crower.com/rocker-arms/aluminum-shaft/afr/aluminum-shaft-rocker-arms.html ($1360)

http://www.jegs.com/i/AFR/033/1067/...0&cadevice=c&gclid=CKy3wprotcgCFYkBaQodDw4Hxw ($1660)

http://www.speedwaymotors.com/COMP-Cams-894-16-Offset-Roller-Lifters,38802.html ($525)

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...sfire-vette-won-t-run-right.10096/#post-39710
 
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