Building a S̶t̶r̶o̶n̶g̶ ̶3̶5̶0̶ 383 for Frank the Tank…

[JimmyDuncan]

Welcome .

Here's what am thinking for the street.
internal balance 383, 5.7" rod. (i know everyone will tell you 6" rod internal balance)
Can't help for head and intake. 64cc head 383CID assembly above = 10.7:1~ CR with standard FELPRO gasket and some decking of the block.

Holley 650-700 CFM, everyone oversize carburator..
If you can afford it go roller cam with synthetic oil(once the break in's complete). Better durability(or peace of mind) and roller lobe ramp are steeper for more flow/performance.
Am not a fan of higher ratio rocker... Just get the correct lift/cam.

I think a cam with about 225-235 duration 110 LSA and around 0.500 lift.
and then match the rear gear ratio and torque converter to that.

The 10 bolt rear should hold up to a 13 second car. .. ok maby am dreaming there but worth a try.

Thats what you need to focus on right now :
Get the engine block prep and ready(especially before ordering the rotating assembly"piston/bore size!!!").
Eagle 383 rotating assembly, ACL bearings rod and main probably (5M909-H and 1B663-H)
High volume oil pump with HD shaft, pump pickup, bigger capacity oil pan, windage screen/tray and plastiguage, Full gasket set(fel-pro).
What block your using? 4 bolt main, 010? (just curious)

Thanks Mathieu, that helps

Why is it you think 5.7" rods?

So, you think its worth a crack running it down the track a couple of times with the 10bolt...? could be exciting..

I was wondering about carbs.. So, smaller than 750 is better? I'll read up on it a bit more.

So, if funds allow I'll look into roller cams. Got it.

You prefer Eagle rotating assembly over SCAT? Any reason?

It's a 4 bolt main apparently.. No reason to suspect the previous owner lied, I'll find out this week when I get it pulled down...

 

[JimmyDuncan]

Id say step one is verify your current rear gear ratio and what rear differential you currently have installed, clear pictures of the differential will be very helpful here! and put the car up on a couple jack stands, so both rear wheels are free to spin, off the ground, and mark the drive shaft with chalk or paint with a clear line and put a index dot or bit or tape on the rear wheel, now pay close attention, spin the rear wheel slowly and see if the other rear wheel spins in the same or the oposite rotational direction, then count the times the drive shaft rotates in a single rotation of the rear wheel.



ID also point out that measuring the rear differential width is very helpful as theres sure to be far stronger rear differentials with similar dimensions and if you have access to a salvage yard and a welder and some fabrication skills finding a replacement rear, having a similar width or a bit narrower to allow a larger and wider tire (ideally with DISC BRAKES )and a stronger design, like a 12 bolt, ford 9" or dana 60, or pontiac 9.3" that can be installed without a great deal of extra effort, other than fabricating the necessary brackets for spring and suspension mounts and matching the drive shaft u-joints and length, that you can purchase reasonably may be a very worth while option
VANS AND PICK-UP TRUCKS ARE FREQUENTLY GOOD SOURCES
yes sounds like a lot of work and expense but its generally something most guys can do or have done reasonably in expensively if they get a good donor car and have a welder ESPECIALLY if you have several helpful and experienced local friends, (this is a great reason to join several local hot rod or corvette clubs as theres always about 10%-15% of the members in most clubs that have both skills and tools that may be willing to help on projects for far less cost than a custom shop charges... and it sure helps if you know what your doing and how to accurately measure, so the works done correctly, (this takes research time on your part!)

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-differantial-and-related-info.757/#post-1085

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...hing-the-drive-train-to-the-engine-combo.741/

Understood

I'll get some pics and test as you described later today.

I have heard that ford 9" diffs are a common upgrade/replacement here in Australia, and it would also be an opportunity to add disc brakes..

Regarding rear gears - Using calculations you describe and aiming for close to 10.25:1 with the TH350 first gear 2.52, I get about 4.07, so I am after 4.11 rear gears? Does the heavy car require any consideration here?

I currently have 23.9" diameter tires.. I will need to get some bigger tires yes?

Thanks.

 

[JimmyDuncan]

Try and follow Grumpys build recipe and advice.
Your not all out drag racing.
They do have a limited life before rebuild time True Racers.
10,000 miles is what I can get from Race 455's. Better than most can do.

Yeah thanks 87vette81big. I hear you

I need to hold down my excitement and not develop eyes bigger than my budget... or go crazy.. I'll save that for the next project.... ha!

I can see how people end up going way over budget and not completing projects forever... I would really like to get this done ready for next summer... So, keeping it in a reasonable budget rather than having to wait and save will help.

 

[JimmyDuncan]

Id say step one is verify your current rear gear ratio and what rear differential you currently have installed, clear pictures of the differential will be very helpful here! and put the car up on a couple jack stands, so both rear wheels are free to spin, off the ground, and mark the drive shaft with chalk or paint with a clear line and put a index dot or bit or tape on the rear wheel, now pay close attention, spin the rear wheel slowly and see if the other rear wheel spins in the same or the oposite rotational direction, then count the times the drive shaft rotates in a single rotation of the rear wheel.



ID also point out that measuring the rear differential width is very helpful as theres sure to be far stronger rear differentials with similar dimensions and if you have access to a salvage yard and a welder and some fabrication skills finding a replacement rear, having a similar width or a bit narrower to allow a larger and wider tire (ideally with DISC BRAKES )and a stronger design, like a 12 bolt, ford 9" or dana 60, or pontiac 9.3" that can be installed without a great deal of extra effort, other than fabricating the necessary brackets for spring and suspension mounts and matching the drive shaft u-joints and length, that you can purchase reasonably may be a very worth while option
VANS AND PICK-UP TRUCKS ARE FREQUENTLY GOOD SOURCES
yes sounds like a lot of work and expense but its generally something most guys can do or have done reasonably in expensively if they get a good donor car and have a welder ESPECIALLY if you have several helpful and experienced local friends, (this is a great reason to join several local hot rod or corvette clubs as theres always about 10%-15% of the members in most clubs that have both skills and tools that may be willing to help on projects for far less cost than a custom shop charges... and it sure helps if you know what your doing and how to accurately measure, so the works done correctly, (this takes research time on your part!)

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...-differantial-and-related-info.757/#post-1085

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...hing-the-drive-train-to-the-engine-combo.741/

I got the car up on jack stands and gave the wheel a spin. The other wheel slowly turned the other direction, but not with any real sense of urgency... So, I lowered one side and spun the upside wheel two turns... The drive shaft spun just over 3 1/4 turns, which gives me 3.23 or 3.25 gears yes?

Here's a pick of the diff from the rear



It's a 10 bolt 8.2" it seems.

I read a few articles on beefing up the 10 bolt, but it seems that replacing is really the preferred option.. Though a few guys in forums mentioned having a 12 bolt or some other sitting ready to install and the 10 bolt just surviving on...

 

[JimmyDuncan]

I started pulling down Grimy the sad 350 tonight...

I have always been good at pulling things apart, so I was in my element. I tried to examine everything with a critical eye as I went, to get a feel for what I was working with... I felt like I had done it before... I've watch that many YouTube clips, it seemed like I was more experienced than I am.. ha!



The heads are 3998993 castings, which a quick search showed up as not being anything special..



One of the first things I noticed upon removing the valve covers was some debris sitting around the outer cylinder head bolts.... Haven't come across what the debris was originally.... Hopefully not a sign of something horrible..?



The lifter valley was clean and free of crap or debris (other than what fell in when I removed the intake)... But, the state of the intake ports and the cooling tunnels leads me to believe that the engine may have been less recently running than I was led to believe, But, I haven't seen the inside of a 40 year old engine before, so, maybe I'm just picky....




I managed to get one head off before calling it a night and was disappointed to find that the engine has been rebuilt previously... The pistons are marked .030, which means that the guy I bought it off had been mislead by the guy he bought it off, or he was having me on... Who knows...



On the plus side, the cylinders looked clean and free of scoring or damage as far as I could tell and the crosshatching was visible..

I'll keep pulling Grimy down tomorrow evening.

So, the question is, assuming I continue to disassemble and everything else is OK. I can still work with this block....?

 

[mathd]

With 5.7 rod piston speed is faster at TDC, that help reduce detonation when running pump gas and high compression.
And with 6 inch rod the oil ring will be into the piston pin bore(am not really a fan on that). Most people will use 6 inch rod because it reduce stress on the crank and cylinder(but we are no nascar here). So 6 inch rod are mostly for peace of mind. ( i use forged 5.7 rod in my 383, i think they are lunati)

5.7 inch rod piston speed is faster on TDC, slower at BDC. 6 inch rod is the other way around. piston speed is slower at TDC and faster at BDC.
6 inch rod is easier to balance internally and require smaller bob weigth. No noticable hp difference.

Each one have a positive and negative. I could say both are great and you could use both.
Since your on a budget, If you have the 5.7 rod already(wich you should), no need to get another set of 6" rod, both are great. You just save 600$ for something else. The stock SBC rod are pretty strong.

yes smaller that 750CFM is great. i tell you a little secret. i run a blown 383 redline 6000rpm 5-6psi boost 8.7:1 CR, and i use only a 700 CFM.
If i was all out drag racing i'd use a 750CFM MAX not a single cfm more(and probably a bigger blower and .. and.. and..).

Scat vs eagle, since your on a budjet, i say get the eagle. if the price difference is not much(or you can get a good deal on the scat) go with the scat.. I run a eagle forged crank and i have zero problem with it.

The 10 bolt, with slick on a good sticky track, saying it will hold up and be reliable is pure lie with . My camaro my 10 bolt 8.5 inch ring gear still hold up to me(but no slick tire no track) just alot of burned rubber and no traction . And i know someday it will break. (burnout in 2nd to 3rd gear from 0 to 70Mph is alot of fun (and adrenaline)) Someday i will try burnout in 4th gear, but i need a stronger rear end and stronger trans(and a longer backroad + more balls), can't afford to ruin it for now.
Looking at your picture you have the old/small 10 bolt 8,2 ring gear, it will definatly NOT hold up to track time + slicks with that heavy car).

I have seem many people with project that never ever gets done.
Do it one part at a time, now the engine. when the engine is done you can ride it and enjoy it. Then the rear end and other stuff. Don't take everything apart at once and try to rebuild the whole car in one step.
Well you can but from experience its a bad idea(except if you have alot of time and money).

 

[Indycars]

And with 6 inch rod the oil ring will be into the piston pin bore(am not really a fan on that).

That maybe true for some pistons, but not all. I have 6 inch rods and the oil groove is continuous and complete over the piston pin.

5.7 inch rod piston speed is faster on TDC, slower at BDC. 6 inch rod is the other way around. piston speed is slower at TDC and faster at BDC.

I will have to respectfully differ on the point above if I understand you correctly. The velocity curve is the same at TDC and BDC.

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...ues-of-piston-velocity-acceleration-wgt.6636/


Yes there is a difference in velocity between the 5.7 and 6.0 inch rods, but not all the much difference. The difference in distance traveled at 10° is only 0.0005 inches and at 20° is still only 0.0018 inches

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...ator-for-piston-position-vs-crank-angle.4385/

 

[mathd]

It do change the dwell too, and when all the small difference stack together.. see what i mean .
383 are 400 crank stroke 3.75.. 400 sbc rod are shorter that 5.7 and it was never a problem.. There is really no engine longevity problem using the 5,7 rod in a 383 if he has them already. To me, its not worth the expense to get new rod only for this reason. Like i said, both length are perfect and the diference is really negligible. If he has the 5,7 it make no sense to get new 6" rod. There's a reason i used 5.7 rod in my 383(i think it had to do with the blower, CR and fuel pump octane), i just need to remember it .

I dont remember where i read that, but it had a really good explanation of the difference between 5.7 and 6 inch rod. If i find it i will post here.

P.S. i dont like your piston

 

[87vette81big]

Jimmy is pretty typical of young Hotrodders today Rick.
He has a Realistic set budget of $3,000.
Enough to build the 383 shortblock using stock block.
Or build a 355-358ci with budget iron performance heads.
Can't do both likely. 383 and Good heads.
Mathew is keeping it real.
Just watching on this thread.

 

[philly]

with grumpy's suggestion of heads and rotator your buying some very high performance stuff for the money. unfortunately the $3k figured will be shattered once we get into rear ends, suspension mods, torque converter and the other accompanying parts that go into making the total combo which is the entire car.

on the plus side, rome wasnt built in a day and with some carefully sourced deals you can infact save plenty of coin by getting certain parts used (grumpys suggestion for the differential is a great example of pennies on the dollar for a real upgraded rear end) and a set of headers (even cracked ones with warped flanges can be fixed sometimes cheaper than the new parts would cost with shipping to oz) and an intake manifold all used can be put to great use while saving alot of money.

the patience and time it requires to score the deals and amass the parts will simultaneously give you extra time to put more money aside and be able to achieve your goals. its not unheard of for a four door small block car to go deep in the thirteens, i think its very realistic but you're gonna have to be smart about it.

good thing there are alot of hot rods in your country and once you tap into that community locally you should be able to find plenty of exciting parts to get you going.

another way to go faster while keeping cost down is weight reduction. most people would object to cutting out the structural integrity of the car itself, but there are some areas you can trim the fat with a cutting wheel, hole saw, and reciprocating saw that wont compromise your safety. in the range of speeds and power we are discussing every hundred pounds shed should be worth a tenth of a second off your 1/4 mile elapsed time in a perfect world.... some times it nets you more and some times it nets you less...

if you are handy with a welder or have access to one and can practice with it.... you should build up some confidence welding some scraps together and then attack two key points at the front end of the car:

the radiator support, top and bottom, is usually pretty heavy and has alot of excess metal there, cutting the entire support out and replacing it with two tubular pieces of steel to which you can affix the radiator and maintain horizontal integrity in the nose of the frame could save you 20 pounds or more.

the crossmember upon which the motor sits is another overwhelmingly large and heavy piece of steel... this bit is slightly more complicated as the steering is also usually mounted here, but after the radiator support you should be able to guide yourelf through this... when in doubt, youtube it. or look for an aftermarket company that makes and sells the part you want to make, and email them asking for instructions to their part... usually reading through the instructions carefully will draw you a map for how to build your own parts since someone else has already done the engineering and jumped the unforseen hurdles for you.








you could also get crazy with the 3 and 4 inch hole saws, pull all your interior panels, and swiss cheese the car inside and then put the panels back so no one is the wiser... remember ounces add up to pounds, tenths add up to seconds.... its all in how much you are comfortable with and what you can do personally or have farmed out to a friend or a shop... thats whats great about hot rodding, the frinds you make, the things we all learn from eachother, and the favors we'll never quite repay haha

 

[philly]

to answer your other question... "which parts should i buy?" is very dependent on the cam, which is very dependent on the heads , once you factor in 1000 dollars for a roller cam and lifters and pushrods and rockers you know whatever cam you buy its probably going to cost you somewhere in that ballpark, a flat tappet could shave a couple hundred dollars off that but theres a certain 100,000 mile peace of mind that comes with reusable roller stuff that may justify the extra initial investment.

once you choose a cylinder head that you like and is in your budget (the IK200 is not, in my opinion, too big for a 383) however a smaller runner with good low end flow will produce a happier more fun combo all else being equal... heres what i would consider when trying to save money and still clean well over 400 whp

http://www.promaxxperformance.com/index.php/racing-parts/sbc/sbc-small-block-chevy-1810.html

these heads outflow most peoples aftermarket ported vortecs, but dont require special intakes like the vortecs do, saving money, and theyre aluminum so they weigh less than vortecs, but with their smaller 185cc intake runner should really wake up downstairs compared to the IK's if for no other reason than port velocity. the ports are already cnc finished, so a simple port matching of your intake to these ports should set you up for success, another note, is that these heads are several hundred dollars less than the IKs and should offset the cost of some other performance part.

note that both the ik200 and these promaxxx heads are both already slung for flat tappet whereas theres another 200cc runner option that comes hydraulic roller ready out of the box... dart pn 127322, which with some minor time with a die grinder could be made to do amazing things...

 

[JimmyDuncan]

With 5.7 rod piston speed is faster at TDC, that help reduce detonation when running pump gas and high compression.
And with 6 inch rod the oil ring will be into the piston pin bore(am not really a fan on that). Most people will use 6 inch rod because it reduce stress on the crank and cylinder(but we are no nascar here). So 6 inch rod are mostly for peace of mind. ( i use forged 5.7 rod in my 383, i think they are lunati)

5.7 inch rod piston speed is faster on TDC, slower at BDC. 6 inch rod is the other way around. piston speed is slower at TDC and faster at BDC.
6 inch rod is easier to balance internally and require smaller bob weigth. No noticable hp difference.

Each one have a positive and negative. I could say both are great and you could use both.
Since your on a budget, If you have the 5.7 rod already(wich you should), no need to get another set of 6" rod, both are great. You just save 600$ for something else. The stock SBC rod are pretty strong.

yes smaller that 750CFM is great. i tell you a little secret. i run a blown 383 redline 6000rpm 5-6psi boost 8.7:1 CR, and i use only a 700 CFM.
If i was all out drag racing i'd use a 750CFM MAX not a single cfm more(and probably a bigger blower and .. and.. and..).

Scat vs eagle, since your on a budjet, i say get the eagle. if the price difference is not much(or you can get a good deal on the scat) go with the scat.. I run a eagle forged crank and i have zero problem with it.

The 10 bolt, with slick on a good sticky track, saying it will hold up and be reliable is pure lie with . My camaro my 10 bolt 8.5 inch ring gear still hold up to me(but no slick tire no track) just alot of burned rubber and no traction . And i know someday it will break. (burnout in 2nd to 3rd gear from 0 to 70Mph is alot of fun (and adrenaline)) Someday i will try burnout in 4th gear, but i need a stronger rear end and stronger trans(and a longer backroad + more balls), can't afford to ruin it for now.
Looking at your picture you have the old/small 10 bolt 8,2 ring gear, it will definatly NOT hold up to track time + slicks with that heavy car).

I have seem many people with project that never ever gets done.
Do it one part at a time, now the engine. when the engine is done you can ride it and enjoy it. Then the rear end and other stuff. Don't take everything apart at once and try to rebuild the whole car in one step.
Well you can but from experience its a bad idea(except if you have alot of time and money).

Cool thanks.

So you think re-using the rods is ok? I had read that they were not up to the standard of new or to the stresses of a more powerful engine..? I'm looking for savings wherever possible, but, I'm willing to spend where it will result in power + durability...

Sounds like I can use a 650cfm carb then.....

I haven't done the price comparison, but, I'll look at scat and eagle.

Yes, I'm seeing that the 10bolt is going to be a very weak point, but, as you say doing each part separately, means that I can at least go cruising sometimes, while the funds recuperate...

I bought the car as a rolling project, so hopefully it can stay on the road more than not

 

[JimmyDuncan]

That maybe true for some pistons, but not all. I have 6 inch rods and the oil groove is continuous and complete over the piston pin.

View attachment 5707



I will have to respectfully differ on the point above if I understand you correctly. The velocity curve is the same at TDC and BDC.

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...ues-of-piston-velocity-acceleration-wgt.6636/

View attachment 5709
Yes there is a difference in velocity between the 5.7 and 6.0 inch rods, but not all the much difference. The difference in distance traveled at 10° is only 0.0005 inches and at 20° is still only 0.0018 inches

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...ator-for-piston-position-vs-crank-angle.4385/

View attachment 5708

So Indycars, which is the better choice 5.7 or 6.0? Is there much in the cost? Does it impact clearancing the block? What are your thoughts?

 

[JimmyDuncan]

It do change the dwell too, and when all the small difference stack together.. see what i mean .
383 are 400 crank stroke 3.75.. 400 sbc rod are shorter that 5.7 and it was never a problem.. There is really no engine longevity problem using the 5,7 rod in a 383 if he has them already. To me, its not worth the expense to get new rod only for this reason. Like i said, both length are perfect and the diference is really negligible. If he has the 5,7 it make no sense to get new 6" rod. There's a reason i used 5.7 rod in my 383(i think it had to do with the blower, CR and fuel pump octane), i just need to remember it .

I dont remember where i read that, but it had a really good explanation of the difference between 5.7 and 6 inch rod. If i find it i will post here.

P.S. i dont like your piston

I'd be interested in anything that explains which is preferable out of 5.7 and 6

 

[JimmyDuncan]

Jimmy is pretty typical of young Hotrodders today Rick.
He has a Realistic set budget of $3,000.
Enough to build the 383 shortblock using stock block.
Or build a 355-358ci with budget iron performance heads.
Can't do both likely. 383 and Good heads.
Mathew is keeping it real.
Just watching on this thread.

How much short do you reckon I am going to be on a 383 with good heads 87vette81big? Is it worth me pushing time frames and extending budget a little to get there? Or am I way off?

 

[JimmyDuncan]

with grumpy's suggestion of heads and rotator your buying some very high performance stuff for the money. unfortunately the $3k figured will be shattered once we get into rear ends, suspension mods, torque converter and the other accompanying parts that go into making the total combo which is the entire car.

on the plus side, rome wasnt built in a day and with some carefully sourced deals you can infact save plenty of coin by getting certain parts used (grumpys suggestion for the differential is a great example of pennies on the dollar for a real upgraded rear end) and a set of headers (even cracked ones with warped flanges can be fixed sometimes cheaper than the new parts would cost with shipping to oz) and an intake manifold all used can be put to great use while saving alot of money.

the patience and time it requires to score the deals and amass the parts will simultaneously give you extra time to put more money aside and be able to achieve your goals. its not unheard of for a four door small block car to go deep in the thirteens, i think its very realistic but you're gonna have to be smart about it.

good thing there are alot of hot rods in your country and once you tap into that community locally you should be able to find plenty of exciting parts to get you going.

another way to go faster while keeping cost down is weight reduction. most people would object to cutting out the structural integrity of the car itself, but there are some areas you can trim the fat with a cutting wheel, hole saw, and reciprocating saw that wont compromise your safety. in the range of speeds and power we are discussing every hundred pounds shed should be worth a tenth of a second off your 1/4 mile elapsed time in a perfect world.... some times it nets you more and some times it nets you less...

if you are handy with a welder or have access to one and can practice with it.... you should build up some confidence welding some scraps together and then attack two key points at the front end of the car:

the radiator support, top and bottom, is usually pretty heavy and has alot of excess metal there, cutting the entire support out and replacing it with two tubular pieces of steel to which you can affix the radiator and maintain horizontal integrity in the nose of the frame could save you 20 pounds or more.

the crossmember upon which the motor sits is another overwhelmingly large and heavy piece of steel... this bit is slightly more complicated as the steering is also usually mounted here, but after the radiator support you should be able to guide yourelf through this... when in doubt, youtube it. or look for an aftermarket company that makes and sells the part you want to make, and email them asking for instructions to their part... usually reading through the instructions carefully will draw you a map for how to build your own parts since someone else has already done the engineering and jumped the unforseen hurdles for you.








you could also get crazy with the 3 and 4 inch hole saws, pull all your interior panels, and swiss cheese the car inside and then put the panels back so no one is the wiser... remember ounces add up to pounds, tenths add up to seconds.... its all in how much you are comfortable with and what you can do personally or have farmed out to a friend or a shop... thats whats great about hot rodding, the frinds you make, the things we all learn from eachother, and the favors we'll never quite repay haha

I like that, Rome wasn't built in a day approach Phil. I can see that I'm going to need to replace the rear end (among other things..) pretty smartly after the engine and trans replacement.... But, as you say, if I know what I'm after, I can keep an eye out in the mean time for a well priced used item and/or save up for a new one down the road...

Drag racing is pretty limited in the state I'm in, so the opportunity to actually make a few runs may not present itself for a while anyway... So, I can probably cruise around for a bit, next summer with the 10bolt... It will not be a good match for the rest of the package, but, it would have to be better than the weak combo in Frank as it is... ha!

Chopping holes in Frank the Tank in the name of showing up my dad on the drag strip is a bit drastic!! ha! But, I hear what you're saying.. Maybe a strict diet on my part also...?

I do have a distant future plan hatching (which I don't speak out loud, otherwise my gf may lose her shit..) of building a small car with a big engine, for going fast... I use to have a Holden LJ Torana similar to the one pictured below. It got stolen twice... It weighed about 2300lb... The one I had was a 6 cylinder, but a V8 would make one move...

 

[JimmyDuncan]

to answer your other question... "which parts should i buy?" is very dependent on the cam, which is very dependent on the heads , once you factor in 1000 dollars for a roller cam and lifters and pushrods and rockers you know whatever cam you buy its probably going to cost you somewhere in that ballpark, a flat tappet could shave a couple hundred dollars off that but theres a certain 100,000 mile peace of mind that comes with reusable roller stuff that may justify the extra initial investment.

once you choose a cylinder head that you like and is in your budget (the IK200 is not, in my opinion, too big for a 383) however a smaller runner with good low end flow will produce a happier more fun combo all else being equal... heres what i would consider when trying to save money and still clean well over 400 whp

http://www.promaxxperformance.com/index.php/racing-parts/sbc/sbc-small-block-chevy-1810.html

these heads outflow most peoples aftermarket ported vortecs, but dont require special intakes like the vortecs do, saving money, and theyre aluminum so they weigh less than vortecs, but with their smaller 185cc intake runner should really wake up downstairs compared to the IK's if for no other reason than port velocity. the ports are already cnc finished, so a simple port matching of your intake to these ports should set you up for success, another note, is that these heads are several hundred dollars less than the IKs and should offset the cost of some other performance part.

note that both the ik200 and these promaxxx heads are both already slung for flat tappet whereas theres another 200cc runner option that comes hydraulic roller ready out of the box... dart pn 127322, which with some minor time with a die grinder could be made to do amazing things...

Oh, ok. So, no to the IK200s... thanks. They are pretty pricey...

I didn't realise that the IK200 and the Promaxx (were they Patriot previously?) require changes to work with a roller cam..? Can you explain what's required? and how to tell those that do/don't require changes? What does to cost to change over?

The dart heads sound like a decent deal if they match a roller cam already.. Thanks for the advice.

In your opinion, is the next step after having the block cleaned, checked for cracks, honed/bored, decked and cam bearings installed, then to buy the rotating assembly? If I'm going with a step by step purchase plan, is that the best next step? Buy a full stroker kit or re-use some parts if they are up to it?

Thanks for your advice!

 

[Indycars]

So Indycars, which is the better choice 5.7 or 6.0? Is there much in the cost? Does it impact clearancing the block? What are your thoughts?

There is not enough difference in performance to worry about, both have their pros and cons. But again it's a minor difference.

I check the price on Scat connecting rods and the price is identical at Summit for 5.7 or 6.0 inch rods. Just go with the best deal you can find.

The work to clearance either size connecting rod, will be the same.

My thoughts ....... buy a rotating assembly. You can't do all the machine work to revamp the rods, rod bolts and crank without spending more that just buying a new assembly. Cost is $800-$1000 and that includes pistons, rings and bearing. You just can't do it separately for that price.

BTW, I noticed Scat had .040 over pistons, that might work for you if you don't need to go .060 over to clean up the bores.

 

[philly]

Oh, ok. So, no to the IK200s... thanks. They are pretty pricey...

I didn't realise that the IK200 and the Promaxx (were they Patriot previously?) require changes to work with a roller cam..? Can you explain what's required? and how to tell those that do/don't require changes? What does to cost to change over?

The dart heads sound like a decent deal if they match a roller cam already.. Thanks for the advice.

In your opinion, is the next step after having the block cleaned, checked for cracks, honed/bored, decked and cam bearings installed, then to buy the rotating assembly? If I'm going with a step by step purchase plan, is that the best next step? Buy a full stroker kit or re-use some parts if they are up to it?

Thanks for your advice!

not that the ik's are inferior in any way, they are just not as cheap as some of the other options out there that have proven themselves. yes once you get the block machined, its time to buy the rotating assembly and start putting the bottom end together. new is new and i wouldnt reuse stock rods to save 75 bucks when aftermarket h beams with 7/16 rod bolts are so cheap. im pretty sure the rod bolt / cap / bearing surface is the single most heavily leaned upon part of an entire motor... i cant think of one parts that gets more abuse.

 

[philly]

oh yea and for the roller vs fla tappet head thing.... thats just about what springs come in the heads out of the box.. there may be an ik version thats roller cam ready or it may be a couple bucks more based on the spring change i dont know. but yea basically the spring pressures for a roller cam are different so its usually an "upgrade" to get roller ready springs.