TBucket Engine Project (Dart SHP)

I do not recall any spec given your looking for .
Maybe Grumpy has his own preference.
As long as oil can get in I think your OK.
.002 " would allow oil to flow in.
 
Pontiac V8 all uses a front camshaft thrust end plate.
I always used Mint used with no wear present.
Remade today New.
I just put together & degreed the cam in where I wanted.
 
I can look in my 1987 Corvette GM SERVICE MANUAL.
Maybe a spec is given for camshaft end thrust with the top sprocket installed.
1st year of the factory roller cam in a Vette.
The same cam retainer plate is used.
 
Indycars said:
Are my only options reducing the thickness of the thrust plate or machining the back
of the cam gear?
Click to expand...
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't both of these REDUCE the clearance even further?
The way I see it, you would have to cut the step in the cam slightly deeper (more).
But like Brian says, you only need clearance for oil to get in there, which you do, and if it were
a problem it would have shown up before the 14,000 miles you now have on that engine.
 
Rick your worried about a total NON-ISSUE anything in cam nose to timing cover end play from .002-.008 will work fine.
roller cams are just not that critical in that clearance spec.

a quality hardened cam with proper lube won,t wear like this first two picture's, but notice the lifter stayed on track
camlobe1.jpg

camlobe2.jpg



hardened cam lobes and high quality hardened roller lifter wheels have very low rotational friction,
and as long as the valve train stays in its designed limitations and the inertial loads don,t over come the valve springs ability to maintain constant lifter to lobe contact,
and theres a constant bath of cooling oil flowing over the contact areas,
rates of lifter to lobe contact and wear are minimal or basically non-existent over any reasonable time frame
enginerebuild87.JPG

drilling the pass side oil passage plug with a 1/32" bit so oil constantly sprays on the timing gears, and cam retainer plate areas helps extend chain and gear life.

rollerlifter.jpg

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/cam-spacer-buttons.1793/#post-4553

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...ped-nose-cam-in-early-block.14182/#post-71937
 
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Rick like we discovered yesterday I would consider taking a touch off the bolts holding the retainer plate. Maybe sanding on a flat surface.
 
To get more clearance you have to take it off the nose of the cam in a high speed lathe with a Carbide or CBN Bit.
Or Spot face mill the cam retainer plate where the nose of the cam is present.
Or make a Shim.
 
JohnHancock said:
Rick like we discovered yesterday I would consider taking a touch off the bolts holding the retainer plate. Maybe sanding on a flat surface.
Click to expand...
I think I posted my question before you discovered the possible problem. I'm definitely
going to check into that further.
 
If you sand the Retainer plate flat your still going to end up with .002" no matter how much you sand off.

If you mill the mean diameter of the cam nose on the retainer plate end play will increase.
No way to do it without a Verticle Bridgeport mill accurate and an Electromagnetic Surface Plate.
 
I have an Electromagnetic Surface plate.
Mopar Bob at his work can do it.

I paid $400 for the Electromagnetic surface plate for a project 15 years back.
 
I have a few of those L98 Tpi 350 Roller cam retainer plates back at my house.
Got them NOS for a project.
In my Corvette stash of parts.
 
Loves302Chevy said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't both of these REDUCE the clearance even further?
Click to expand...
Wouldn't the step nose limit travel only when the cam moves forward against the thrust plate. When
it moves backwards, then the limit would be the thrust plate to cam gear surfaces.

It might be a non-issue, but now I want to know!
 
Grumpy said:
Rick your worried about a total NON-ISSUE anything in cam nose to timing cover end play from .002-.008 will work fine.
roller cams are just not that critical in that clearance spec.

a quality hardened cam with proper lube won,t wear like this first two picture's, but notice the lifter stayed on track
camlobe1.jpg

camlobe2.jpg



hardened cam lobes and high quality hardened roller lifter wheels have very low rotational friction,
and as long as the valve train stays in its designed limitations and the inertial loads don,t over come the valve springs ability to maintain constant lifter to lobe contact,
and theres a constant bath of cooling oil flowing over the contact areas,
rates of lifter to lobe contact and wear are minimal or basically non-existent over any reasonable time frame
enginerebuild87.JPG

drilling the pass side oil passage plug with a 1/32" bit so oil constantly sprays on the timing gears, and cam retainer plate areas helps extend chain and gear life.

rollerlifter.jpg

http://garage.grumpysperformance.com/index.php?threads/cam-spacer-buttons.1793/#post-4553

http://garage.grumpysperformance.co...ped-nose-cam-in-early-block.14182/#post-71937
Click to expand...

Grumpy thinks its a Non Issue.
So do I.

Its not like its going to turn 7000-9000 rpms.

6000 redline.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
look at it this way you put several thousand miles on the cam to retainer plate clearance issue , as it was run up until now,
without it causing your engine any problems, what makes you assume its now a critical issue?
 
I'm not loosing sleep over it, but if it was easy and cost a couple of bucks then I would have
liked to open it up a little.

I checked the clearance to the thrust plate bolts, and there is at least .005 inches. When
John and I were checking yesterday, I believe I got the paper too far in. It was actually
between the thrust plate and cam gear.

FP16_CamGearClearance_00369.jpg

You can see where the cam gear is polishing the thrust plate.

FP16_CramThrustPlateWear_00371.jpg

I can't determine which cam locking plate I need, they just don't give enough info. I have
both Comp Cams 4605 and a Crane 99168-1 and neither one fit. The bolt circle diameter
is too large, they must be for a flat face cam, but I have the step nose which would require
a smaller diameter.
 
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Loves302Chevy said:
Rick, use a washer under 1 of the 3 cam bolts to cover enough of the bushing that it can't walk out.
I also used a drop of red Loctite on mine as extra insurance.
Click to expand...
I looked at the washer idea last night and it would take a 3/8 inch washer on a 5/16 inch cam
bolt to overlap the offset bushing. I have some SS washers that are thinner than all the other
steel washers I have. I just might have to do this.

Yes Red Loctite is a must!
 
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