Loves302Chevy
"One test is worth a thousand expert opinions."
Hey, if 1 small white wire was your biggest problem, then you are doing GREAT. Fire that sucker up!
AND DON'T FORGET THE VIDEO!
AND DON'T FORGET THE VIDEO!
Unforgiven Project
- Thread starter Unforgiven
- Start date
Unforgiven
solid fixture here in the forum
Sorry for the delay Men...I fell ill for a few days.
Ok..Yesterday I felt better enough to head for the barn. Coty stopped by to lend a hand. After connecting the white wire, we did get spark!
Only it was 180 degrees out..
After removing the valve covers and verifying the valves were lashed correctly , ( took no chances on anything) we reinstalled the distributor
180 degrees.
Not bad so far...
After all checks were made... we hit the start button only to hear metal hitting metal sound!!!!!
We removed the valve covers again to see if I missed anything... ALL was GOOD.
So we removed the blower belt and rotated the rotors to see if maybe something had fell in. Again all checked good.
At this point we just sat back and replayed the build and went over documents I had made.
We pulled all the plugs and turned the motor over by hand . There was NO bind or interference to be found!!!!!
After one more cup of coffee I seen that the teeth on the flex plate Had metal removed from them. Then I seen some shavings on the floor
under the stand and flexplate.
We found the culpurate! After removing the starter....Coty chucked up on each bolt with a battery drill and found that the bolts were bent pretty bad. We made a trip to the parts store for new starter bolts and decided to have the mini torque starter replaced as well (it had a lifetime warrenty).
With new bolts and starter installed...and giving the motor another look over, we decided we would try to roll the motor over with no plugs
or spark..
It was quiet!!!!!
We installed the plugs and connected the fuel pump and the coil wire...also said a prayer !!!
The E-70 fuel we were using for a test start was not wanting to lite in the cold temperature, but it soon did!
We checked the oil pressure (50 lbs).
Listened for any out of ordinary sound and found nothing.
We found that the idle A/F was at 8.2 which is very rich. Should have been near 10 with E70.
But we were not tuning....We were looking for a solid smooth running motor.
After the video... we hooked up a timing light and found that the motor was hunting for an idle. We set the static timing at 15 degrees according to Holley. Timing was bouncing a few degrees around the 15 degree mark because of the hunting issue.
This will be close enough for Steve to dial in when we run the VP- C85 in a warmer enviroment.
There were no leaks around the pan where I had fixed it, or anywhere else.
There was no knocking sounds anywhere !!!!!!!
We decided to shut the motor down after bringing it up to operating temp and call it a successful rebuild (so far).
We are putting the engine back on it's cradle and bolting it to a pallet that we will box in with plywood for the trip accross state to see Steve on the 17th.
Enjoy the video!
Ok..Yesterday I felt better enough to head for the barn. Coty stopped by to lend a hand. After connecting the white wire, we did get spark!
Only it was 180 degrees out..
After removing the valve covers and verifying the valves were lashed correctly , ( took no chances on anything) we reinstalled the distributor
180 degrees.
Not bad so far...
After all checks were made... we hit the start button only to hear metal hitting metal sound!!!!!
We removed the valve covers again to see if I missed anything... ALL was GOOD.
So we removed the blower belt and rotated the rotors to see if maybe something had fell in. Again all checked good.
At this point we just sat back and replayed the build and went over documents I had made.
We pulled all the plugs and turned the motor over by hand . There was NO bind or interference to be found!!!!!
After one more cup of coffee I seen that the teeth on the flex plate Had metal removed from them. Then I seen some shavings on the floor
under the stand and flexplate.
We found the culpurate! After removing the starter....Coty chucked up on each bolt with a battery drill and found that the bolts were bent pretty bad. We made a trip to the parts store for new starter bolts and decided to have the mini torque starter replaced as well (it had a lifetime warrenty).
With new bolts and starter installed...and giving the motor another look over, we decided we would try to roll the motor over with no plugs
or spark..
It was quiet!!!!!
We installed the plugs and connected the fuel pump and the coil wire...also said a prayer !!!
The E-70 fuel we were using for a test start was not wanting to lite in the cold temperature, but it soon did!
We checked the oil pressure (50 lbs).
Listened for any out of ordinary sound and found nothing.
We found that the idle A/F was at 8.2 which is very rich. Should have been near 10 with E70.
But we were not tuning....We were looking for a solid smooth running motor.
After the video... we hooked up a timing light and found that the motor was hunting for an idle. We set the static timing at 15 degrees according to Holley. Timing was bouncing a few degrees around the 15 degree mark because of the hunting issue.
This will be close enough for Steve to dial in when we run the VP- C85 in a warmer enviroment.
There were no leaks around the pan where I had fixed it, or anywhere else.
There was no knocking sounds anywhere !!!!!!!
We decided to shut the motor down after bringing it up to operating temp and call it a successful rebuild (so far).
We are putting the engine back on it's cradle and bolting it to a pallet that we will box in with plywood for the trip accross state to see Steve on the 17th.
Enjoy the video!
T-Test
solid fixture here in the forum
Not until he gets it to the Dyno room.
Unforgiven
solid fixture here in the forum
Coty left them at home!
We were so occupied with what ended up being that starter issue....we just used a stethascope.
It's Dr. Coty now! LOL
Loves302Chevy
"One test is worth a thousand expert opinions."
So far, so good. Congratulations.
Unforgiven
solid fixture here in the forum
Thanks Men! It really did feel good to hear that motor actually running again
Dr. Coty and I were discussing which way I was going to move forward with on the crank case venting.
I had originally planned on installing -12AN baffles in the valve covers , then hardlining them somewhere to an external oil catch can with a breather.
Being that I have an EVAC kit from Summit on the shelf... Coty suggested that I just use that kit instead.
Now.. Steve Morris texted me about this and said not to install evac tubes in the exhaust because it will destroy the O2 sensor.
So Coty suggested installing the tubes down stream (about 18" from the O2 sensor) near the outlet of the collector.
I will look into this before I do anything on the exhaust. But I like the idea of installing the breathers in the valve covers.
Coty mentioned that he and alot of the other guys are always replacing the rubber seal on the valve cover because the seal is about 1" tall
and the valve covers are about an 1/8" thick.. He thinks the covers are acting like a knife and cutting the seal over time.
So... he suggested that I turn up some aluminum bungs about an 7/8" tall, and weld them to the top of the valve covers.
This will give the seal a wall to seal against instead of a thin knife edge to seal against.
I really do like this idea and will be modifying the covers this weekend.
I'll make sure to take pics of the process to better explain what is going on. But I think you men get it.
Dr. Coty and I were discussing which way I was going to move forward with on the crank case venting.
I had originally planned on installing -12AN baffles in the valve covers , then hardlining them somewhere to an external oil catch can with a breather.
Being that I have an EVAC kit from Summit on the shelf... Coty suggested that I just use that kit instead.
Now.. Steve Morris texted me about this and said not to install evac tubes in the exhaust because it will destroy the O2 sensor.
So Coty suggested installing the tubes down stream (about 18" from the O2 sensor) near the outlet of the collector.
I will look into this before I do anything on the exhaust. But I like the idea of installing the breathers in the valve covers.
Coty mentioned that he and alot of the other guys are always replacing the rubber seal on the valve cover because the seal is about 1" tall
and the valve covers are about an 1/8" thick.. He thinks the covers are acting like a knife and cutting the seal over time.
So... he suggested that I turn up some aluminum bungs about an 7/8" tall, and weld them to the top of the valve covers.
This will give the seal a wall to seal against instead of a thin knife edge to seal against.
I really do like this idea and will be modifying the covers this weekend.
I'll make sure to take pics of the process to better explain what is going on. But I think you men get it.
Unforgiven
solid fixture here in the forum
Just got off the phone with Steve. It's all set for the 17th!!
Very exciting day awaits me.
Costs are climbing unexpectedly but they are nessesities that need to be addressed.
2 - sets of plugs
2 gallons of VR1 20-50 (already have 2 new filters )
extra blower belts in case one snaps
small bag of hand tools. ( we will be doing all the wrenching when and where needed)
not too bad..
I have been reading up on the Gates RPM belts.... It seems that these belts only need 25-30% on the tensioner. These belts do not stretch and under deceleration , they make that tensioner buck hard.
The poly belts seem to work best around 80% tension because they stretch. They do not make the tensioner buck so hard.
I am going to remove the belt and etch some marks near the tensioner arm and blower snout as to where the %'s are in the tension arm travel.
I think this will give me a great starting point as to how long the different belts need to be for the different pulley combo's I will have.
I seems I may have to order a different size belt for the same pulley combo, depending on the type of belt That I choose.
Thunderbolt was on to something when he was mentioning this about the RPM belt.
Thank you Sir for opening that door of curiosity!!
At the cost's of these belts...I do not want to purchase too many.
So... with dyno day coming on quick, I still have alot of work to do..
Very exciting day awaits me.
Costs are climbing unexpectedly but they are nessesities that need to be addressed.
2 - sets of plugs
2 gallons of VR1 20-50 (already have 2 new filters )
extra blower belts in case one snaps
small bag of hand tools. ( we will be doing all the wrenching when and where needed)
not too bad..
I have been reading up on the Gates RPM belts.... It seems that these belts only need 25-30% on the tensioner. These belts do not stretch and under deceleration , they make that tensioner buck hard.
The poly belts seem to work best around 80% tension because they stretch. They do not make the tensioner buck so hard.
I am going to remove the belt and etch some marks near the tensioner arm and blower snout as to where the %'s are in the tension arm travel.
I think this will give me a great starting point as to how long the different belts need to be for the different pulley combo's I will have.
I seems I may have to order a different size belt for the same pulley combo, depending on the type of belt That I choose.
Thunderbolt was on to something when he was mentioning this about the RPM belt.
Thank you Sir for opening that door of curiosity!!
At the cost's of these belts...I do not want to purchase too many.
So... with dyno day coming on quick, I still have alot of work to do..
Unforgiven
solid fixture here in the forum
I also asked about the Scat 9000 crank being able to handle the expected power levels.
He says he would not worry too much at my levels. That was reassuring to hear.. even coming from a guy I am paying
to possibly blow up my motor.
He says he would not worry too much at my levels. That was reassuring to hear.. even coming from a guy I am paying
to possibly blow up my motor.
Unforgiven
solid fixture here in the forum
It's been an exciting week so far getting ready for the Dyno day tomorrow!
I got the engine off the test stand and back onto the cradle.
I screwed a 1/2" piece of plywood onto a pallet for a solid surface the cradle can sit on. I then used 2 x 2 pieces to box in the casters in
place on the pallet. Then I screwed in some eye hooks so I could lock the cradle down onto the pallet. Then I framed a box out of 1/4"
OSB to package the engine completly.
I got it loaded into the bed last night and got it all strapped down with 3" wide ratchet straps. This package is locked down firmly
and will not move at all if I ever had to hit the brakes hard.
Being that it's a 4 + hour trip, I am taking NO chances.
Here's a pic before I strapped it down.
This pic is prior to mounting the plywood to the pallet. Basically I was sizing the engine to the pallet.
I have a total of 4 extra blower belts for the different pulley combo's, 2 sets of pulley combo's, 2 sets of #9 plugs, 1 set of #8 plugs, 10 quarts of VR1 20-50 oil, for when I change the break in oil before we actually do any pulls.
Tonight Coty and I are using the fuel pump on the truck to transfer 10 gallons of fuel from the drum into the cans for the trip.
Then we will unbolt the pump and take it with us . Everything else along with the build sheets are in a box that was loaded up last night.
I want to give Steve all the information there is , so there is no guessing on the tune.
Taking a few hand tools and the torque wrench also.
We are pulling out at 3:30 tomorrow morning. Forecast looks good for the trip over there, but it ain't looking good for the trip back. They say there is a major winter storm rolling in. We are expecting up to 12" of snow along with sleet. We will be heading east on the way home, so hopefully we can stay ahead of the storm.
We were laughing at all the problems I have had with this build. Now, I have to deal with the weather!
It seems it is always something.
But.......GOD HATES A COWARD!!
I will take lots of pics and video's if I am allowed to while I am over there!
Just hope I can get some sleep tonight cause tomorrow is going to come early!
I got the engine off the test stand and back onto the cradle.
I screwed a 1/2" piece of plywood onto a pallet for a solid surface the cradle can sit on. I then used 2 x 2 pieces to box in the casters in
place on the pallet. Then I screwed in some eye hooks so I could lock the cradle down onto the pallet. Then I framed a box out of 1/4"
OSB to package the engine completly.
I got it loaded into the bed last night and got it all strapped down with 3" wide ratchet straps. This package is locked down firmly
and will not move at all if I ever had to hit the brakes hard.
Being that it's a 4 + hour trip, I am taking NO chances.
Here's a pic before I strapped it down.
This pic is prior to mounting the plywood to the pallet. Basically I was sizing the engine to the pallet.
I have a total of 4 extra blower belts for the different pulley combo's, 2 sets of pulley combo's, 2 sets of #9 plugs, 1 set of #8 plugs, 10 quarts of VR1 20-50 oil, for when I change the break in oil before we actually do any pulls.
Tonight Coty and I are using the fuel pump on the truck to transfer 10 gallons of fuel from the drum into the cans for the trip.
Then we will unbolt the pump and take it with us . Everything else along with the build sheets are in a box that was loaded up last night.
I want to give Steve all the information there is , so there is no guessing on the tune.
Taking a few hand tools and the torque wrench also.
We are pulling out at 3:30 tomorrow morning. Forecast looks good for the trip over there, but it ain't looking good for the trip back. They say there is a major winter storm rolling in. We are expecting up to 12" of snow along with sleet. We will be heading east on the way home, so hopefully we can stay ahead of the storm.
We were laughing at all the problems I have had with this build. Now, I have to deal with the weather!
It seems it is always something.
But.......GOD HATES A COWARD!!
I will take lots of pics and video's if I am allowed to while I am over there!
Just hope I can get some sleep tonight cause tomorrow is going to come early!
Thunderbolt
Well-Known Member
Are you going to dyno it with the Hillborn style air cleaner? I have one like it but have not used it since the small air filter looks to be hurting air flow/boost.
Very interesting to se the results, since i also use a 177 blower and E85 fuel.
Wish you luck with the dyno and have a safe trip!
Very interesting to se the results, since i also use a 177 blower and E85 fuel.
Wish you luck with the dyno and have a safe trip!
Unforgiven
solid fixture here in the forum
Yes. I am going to do a pull with that air cleaner, then change it out to a 14" round air cleaner t see the difference. I was concerned about the Hilborn style limiting air flow also. It would seem that the small 6" air cleaner would restrict the flow, But I am curios as to the pressures
that the hat will produce.
that the hat will produce.
Unforgiven
solid fixture here in the forum
If you look at the last pic, you can see the marks I installed on the blower snout for each pulley combo with a new belt. I figure this will
be a good reference to see if a belt has stretched. The Gates RPM belt shows it has 25% tensioner load. If I understood my research, This will stop the tensioner from slamming the hard stop and snapping the belt. The poly belts have about 70% tension, which I feel is on the light side.
They do stretch, and that is the reson for a higher tension to start. As the belt stretches, the tension becomes less, causing belt slippage.
be a good reference to see if a belt has stretched. The Gates RPM belt shows it has 25% tensioner load. If I understood my research, This will stop the tensioner from slamming the hard stop and snapping the belt. The poly belts have about 70% tension, which I feel is on the light side.
They do stretch, and that is the reson for a higher tension to start. As the belt stretches, the tension becomes less, causing belt slippage.
Unforgiven
solid fixture here in the forum
Wait till Steve hears that M&M racing helped me build this combo!!!
I want to see if he has heard about you.
It would be funny if he said yes!
I want to see if he has heard about you.
It would be funny if he said yes!
Unforgiven
solid fixture here in the forum
I forgot to mention that My Duramax has rails mounted in the bed for my gooseneck and 5th wheel attachments. I removed the attachment, and the slats on the bottom of the pallet fell in between the two rails with a 1/4" to spare! This will keep the pallet from sliding for and aft!